Traction control

[MDB]

Thanks for the reply Mike, that's useful to know. What percentage of fuel is cut by the Racelogic system, does it attempt to cut fuel completely or limit it to 50% per cylinder during the TC event?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Complete injector pulses are blocked by the TC ECU, so the affected cylinder just takes a gulp of fresh air for that cycle. There will be no fuel entering the cylinder, so of course no chance of a lean burn.

[MDB]

just had a thought and I appologise if it has been raised before, too busy to read the entire thread. The TC cuts fuel as tarction is lost. We are always going on about the dangers of running lean causing knock and subsequant piston damage especially on turbocharged cars. Am I barking up the wrong tree here or what??

db

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

RLTC has never been the cause of engine damage. We just would not be in a position to keep selling them (and we sell more now than ever) if this problem was even slightly possible.

Technical explanation can be found here.

[M Blur]

I can only say it has tranformed my rear-wayward M Roadster into sth that's chuckable culminating in a fast road icey adventure along the side of Loch Tay.. awesome.. if you know what the rear is going to do then it makes it a lot easier to simply focus on turn in and understeer... I find the RLTC works almost like an E-diff when set to work alongside my 25% lsd... you can set the angle which varies the amount the lsd can work before the TC cut in... My MR runs approx 350bhp currently with instant torque and razor throttle response so the added assistance is greatly appreciated.

Edited March 9, 2006 by M Blur

[bobbak]

Right then fellas.

I have the Traction controll system fitted and to be blunt its FERKINN ACE so to set a few doubts right.

before I do the main post on this.

Lean burn not an issue at all

degraded cats not and issue at all

reason why well the esprit runs a sequential injection system so therefore when this system is running in anger the control unit is cutting an injector pulse every 1000th of a second sequentialy retrospective to firing sequence so at the time of the cut there is no fuel delivery on into the engine cylinder so only fresh air is going to exit the exhaust during any event for the duration of that event.

With a v8 having 8 cylinders during an event and for the duration of that event on a sequential basis I am only loosing 12% of my power output per cylnder that is sequentially cut on 4 cylnder models that would rise to 25%

so for v8's the tc events are very very smooth and all you here from the engine is a very slight burble sound

on the 4 cylnders this sound would obviously increase but by how much I cant say as I dont have one

Secondary injectors the % of fuel delivery is 8% in relation to the mains and only active at high throttle settings 130 Mph+ unlikely you would get slip at these speeds but the system can be programmed to turn the TC system off at a preset speed before the secondarys come on line if it was of concern but really it isn't!!

Ease to fit you get a complete guide on fitment you will need to know the colour coding of your ecu to injector firing lines but the pick offs for the abs are all at the controll unit under the front bonett and get this you dont have to drill anything the digi adjuster fits right into the small change slot by the gear lever move it to the right a little and you dont even have to take your hand off the gear lever to asdjust the system THE WHOLE SYSTEM IS FITTED USINF EXISTING LOTUS MADE HOLES IN THE CAR WHAT MORE COULD YOU ASK FOR!!!

ECU side would be a lot easier if you removed the off side rear quater glass but we chose not to

I have loads of pictures will post the as soon as I can tonight will right a review over the next few days as I experiment with it and anyone who still has doubts can try it out at donny

but to end this one this was the best

[Jonathan]

Top bombing !

Glad you're happy with it - can't wait to see the pictures.

Hope to catch up with you at Donnington although looking unlikely now as my car is STILL at the specialist/garage, no work has been done on it at all since last Saturday

[scoule]

but to end this one this was the best

[bobbak]

Can you simply nail the throttle in 2nd / 3rd in the wet now? No drama etc ... must feel bloody strange!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The launch control feature allows you to nail the throttle in 1st and the engine revs do not rise above the given parameters set by you upon instalation then drop the clutch and your off as you change up through the box the system changes the limitations on rev range automatically so that with your foot hard down you can change gear and the engine does not scream or over rev (ie) continual throttle on if you want it

as for nailing the throttle in 2nd and third yes hard as you want as much as you dare the system adjusts the injector pulses to ensure maximum traction in all gears at all speeds and yes its taking some getting used to as it requires a different mind set for driving if you want to hammer it the system can do much more than you are capable of and its bottle never goes yours will first.

hopefully will get these pictures on here tonight

regards rob

[Jonathan]

Mike - I have a few important questions about the 4 Cylinder Esprit.

After looking at the system Rob has had fitted to the V8 I was looking through the wring diagrams and noticed the 4 Cylinder cars operates the injections very much differently than the V8.

The V8 is individual, 8 wires, one for each injector - however the 4 banger only had 2 control wires back to the ECU with injectors 1-4 and 2-3 being controlled in parallel.

This is a clip from the manual :

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"The electronic multi-point fuel injection system used on the Lotus Esprit Turbo Intercooler is a General Motors fully electronic, processor controlled system, using a separate fuel injector in the intake tract of each cylinder. An additional pair of injectors in the intake plenum, supplement fuel delivery during periods of maximum demand.

The injectors are supplied with fuel at constant pressure (relative to intake manifold pressure) from a common fuel rail, with the guantity of fuel delivered to the engine being controlled by the length of time for which the solenoid operated injectors are opened.

The four port injectors are 'pulsed' in two pairs (l/4 and 2/3) normally once every engine revolution, with half of the fuel requirement for each cylinder's conbustion being supplied by each pulse.

The Direct Ignition (D.I.) system does away with the conventional distributor and uses two separate ignition coils, a flywheel position sensor, an ignition module and Electronic Spark Timing (E.S.T.) control circuitry incorporated into the E.C.M. This type of distributorless ignition system uses a 'waste spark' method of distribution wherein cylinder pairs 1/4 and 2/3 are provided with a spark every revolution, i.e. on both compression stroke and exhaust stroke. At engine cranking speed the ignition module (part of the ignition coil pack) alone controls the spark advance, but at speeds above 700 rpm, the E.C.M. takes over ignition timing control based on inlet manifold air pressure, air temperature, coolant temperature, engine speed and detection of the onset of detonation."

"The ECM uses three injector driver circuits, with one circuit controlling port injectors 1 and 4, one controlling 2 and 3 and a third circuit controlling the two plenum injectors. Each port injector circuit pulses its two injectors simultaneously once every crankshaft revolution, with half of the fuel necessary for each cylinders combustion delivered by each injector pulse. For minimum fuel supply conditions however, such as idle, a single pulse every two engine revolutions is supplied. The ECM receives an engine speed and crankshaft position signal twice per engine revolution from the ignition module, and uses these to trigger the 'alternate pairs' injector timing sequence. Each injection pulse occurs only when both inlet valves for that pair of cylinders, are closed."

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I must admit I am not entirely sure why this happens and the injectors are not controlled individually, however am I correct in thinking in order to controll these injectors you'd basically treat it like a 2 cylinder ?

Each of the paired injectors use a common wire back to the ECM - I guess you could control each injector individually by parallel-ing up the reutrn (-ve) lines into the controller - but that way you'd still get fuel into 1 half cycle on each engine revolution.

Edited March 13, 2006 by Jonathan

[Simon350S]

I believe this kind of system was used quite readily in the early stages of multi point fuel injection.

From what i recall the early mitsubish Evos used the same system.

Not much help as far as this thread goes but hey I thought i'd post it anyways!

[jetfixr123]

Well,

After spending the afternoon slipping around on the streets, I think I'm sold on traction control. I am impressed with the good looks of my V8 Esprit and of course the power, but having to control that throttle just takes too much patience! My first Lotus! Glad I made the right move!

Drove a Noble M400 (almost bought) a few weeks ago before I bought the Lotus, its worse on cold pavement!

Regards,

Ian Roberts

[Jonathan]

Mike,

I'd be very grateful if you could give me your opinions on the 4c Esprit and the your traction control system with regards to the method of cutting the injectors that operate in pairs, I'm assuming this isn't a problem but would like to know for sure - thanks.

[M Blur]

Drove a Noble M400 (almost bought) a few weeks ago before I bought the Lotus, its worse on cold pavement!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Bet she was nippy tho - then when I tell you I want to match one for pace on track long-term and you'll see what an uphill slog I have ahead of me... I may even die in the process...

[MDB]

Mike - I have a few important questions about the 4 Cylinder Esprit.

After looking at the system Rob has had fitted to the V8 I was looking through the wring diagrams and noticed the 4 Cylinder cars operates the injections very much differently than the V8.

The V8 is individual, 8 wires, one for each injector - however the 4 banger only had 2 control wires back to the ECU with injectors 1-4 and 2-3 being controlled in parallel.

I must admit I am not entirely sure why this happens and the injectors are not controlled individually, however am I correct in thinking in order to controll these injectors you'd basically treat it like a 2 cylinder ?

Each of the paired injectors use a common wire back to the ECM - I guess you could control each injector individually by parallel-ing up the reutrn (-ve) lines into the controller - but that way you'd still get fuel into 1 half cycle on each engine revolution.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You'll need to interface with the injectors after they have split from the initial signal wire, and then tell the software to run in non-sequential mode. That'll work fine - many cars are like this.

Edited March 28, 2006 by MDB

[Jonathan]

Yep thats the exact way I was lead to believe from the manual - very well produced btw, haven't even got the hardware and I could work out how to do it from the instructions alone - makes a change to have good documentation !

[Fred Basset]

I believe this kind of system was used quite readily in the early stages of multi point fuel injection.

From what i recall the early mitsubish Evos used the same system.

Not much help as far as this thread goes but hey I thought i'd post it anyways!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I doubt it's the Evo's to be honest. I'm an Evo owner and member of the MLR and to my knowledge none of them have had traction control. The AYC system has nothing to do with traction control.

Regards

Fred

[Simon350S]

I doubt it's the Evo's to be honest. I'm an Evo owner and member of the MLR and to my knowledge none of them have had traction control. The AYC system has nothing to do with traction control.

Regards

Fred

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry, was talking about the paired injectors (i.e. 1&3 and 2&4 working togeather) in an earlier post not the traction control system.