Window Mechanism

[Qavion]

I've had this problem with sluggish window winders for many years, but never had the nerve to pull off the door inners (for fear of damaging the white leather).

Is there a tutorial for this, somewhere? The manual seems to be a bit vague in this area.

I'm just going to try lubricating the mechanisms first. The motor seems to be struggling and will sometimes cut out half way up (and won't go up or down). A few minutes later, I'll try again and it will be fine.

Thanks!

Cheers.

Ian.

[Newts]

Ian

Do a search for 'electric window motor has died' and you will find quite a lot of information covering most of the elements which contribute to Lotus Window Syndrome !

[tjs98jetta]

Ian,

It's pretty easy to get the inner door trim off. As I remember, undo the phillips head screws holding the trim in place around the door frame, then loosen the three screws inside the inner door handle mounting, but don't take them out completely. Remove the plastic trim around the door handle, it splits into two, an upper and lower section. Then the trim comes away as the door handle section goes through the cutout in the door trim. There are some wire connectors that need to be loosened to get the entire iner door trim away, but it's very straightforward.

I played with the adjustment of the window raise/lower mechanism, cleaned it all, applied new lubricant (lithium grease) etc. to get everything moving smoothly. Spraying the felt liners for the window guides with silicone or teflon lube also helps a lot. This stuff seems to contract with age and drag against the window.

Cheers,

Trevor

[Qavion]

Thanks for the tips, guys.

Unfortunately, it wasn't quite as easy as I thought it was going to be. Somehow the trim glued itself to the door frame. The leather did get slightly damaged as I was trying to prise it off, but fortunately not in very visible spots.

I lubed up the mechanism, but I have the feeling that it's something more than this. Either the motor is getting really tired or the gearbox has given up the ghost.

I'd think I'd better do some more reading

Cheers.

Ian.

[Qavion]

Still struggling... The window winder seemed to be fine until I put the door panel back on. Now it's even worse.

I pulled everything apart again and found some crumbling bits of plastic (?) in the bottom of the motor case. Looks like it's non-conducting (not sure if this is required for the motor to operate properly). The rotor is tipped with a similar material.

Is there supposed to be any electrical contact between the metal case and the metal spindle of the rotor?

Cheers.

Ian.

P.S. I've interchanged the window winder up/down rocker switches and the problem is still the same (so it's not the switches).

[Qavion]

Here's a picture of the end of the rotor...

[fjmuurling]

Hi Ian,

the shown end in the picture is juste a bearing, clean that part up and (rotor and housing) and put some small amount of grease on. How is the other end of the roror (ie the collector) and how are the carbon brushes ??

Freek

Edited April 1, 2009 by fjmuurling

[Qavion]

"How is the other end of the rotor (ie the collector) ..."

The other end is the screw drive, Freek. This looks fine, but I would expect this as it's only meshing with the plastic gears.

"... how are the carbon brushes"

The brushes & commutators look fine. I've cleaned the surfaces and made sure the gaps between the segments are clean, too.

Yesterday, I noticed a small chip taken out of one of the magnets (bottom corner). There is also some wear and tear on the ends of the blue winding formers(?), like there has been a lot of sideways and longitudinal movement.

Anyway, I've smoothed the edges of the formers so they won't lock up if they hit that chip in the magnet. I'll reassemble it, then find something to lubricate the guide rails/runners in the door, but I can't find anything suitable at the moment, though. I don't want to put (wet) grease on them, as the aft edge of the glass is normally exposed when the window comes down. Club Lotus is recommending graphite powder, but I hear it is corrosive to aluminium when wet (and very messy if you spill it anywhere... not something I want on my white leather).

All suggestions welcome

Thanks

Cheers.

[fjmuurling]

Yoou are right I ment the commutator (is same as collector in dutch). When I did my windows and motors I took the whole lifting mechanism out and cleaned everything etc and put new grease in the applicable places. The motors I took apart as well and cleaned everything, polished the commutators etc. In the end I tested everything on my workbench if it things were running smoothly. The current draw before the overhaul was around 4A and after the overhaul the current went down to 2A. These measurement were taken with the lifting mechanism out of the door.

Freek

Edited April 1, 2009 by fjmuurling

[Qavion]

Thanks, Freek

Those amperage values will be very handy

Cheers.

Ian

Edited April 2, 2009 by Qavion

[Qavion]

I tried operating the winder out of the car and it's still struggling to move. I took everything apart again. I even took the motor and spring off the arm and felt the resistance of the pivot point (where the long blade/arm pivots on the quadrant. I couldn't believe how tight it was. I drowned it in WD40 (overnight), but it was still tight. The motor would have trouble with this for sure.

I don't see any way of dismantling the pivot point. If this tightness is normal, maybe someone could let me know. If it's not, it looks like I'll have to replace the whole assembly.

Thanks.

Cheers.

Ian.

Edited April 4, 2009 by Qavion

[Qavion]

I took the motor to a general motor repair place. They changed the brushes, but no improvement. The technician thinks that the cutout switch inside the motor is faulty (some kind of overheat/overcurrent sensor). He said he could short it out with no problem, but I'm worried that this is precisely the device used to stop the motor at the window endstops .... or is there some external current sensor on the early Stephen's cars?

Does Lotus still sell the motors? (R/H = B082M6354F)

Found this pic on the web

Cheers

Ian

[rogerch]

Can't help with that, but, I want to take the whole window assembly out of the door, got a bit of rust, and figure I may as well do the whole thing, although mine work, they are not spectacular and I want to put relays in circuit. So any one know if there is a good write up as to how to get the whole window frame and mechanism out?

Roger (do have, or have you thought about using relays in the circuit?)

[Qavion]

Sorry, can't help with the window removal... to me it looks physically impossible (ship in a bottle type of stuff).

I bit the bullet and ordered a new motor from SJSportscars (145UKP plus postage to Australia). It's not quite the same as the original, but SJ will provide spacers and nuts/bolts for the same price.

Unfortunately, this has already cost me a new battery (I wasn't expecting the car to be off the road for a month, so I didn't disconnect it... it's now so flat, it won't recharge).

I'll know better next time

Cheers.

Ian.

[rogerch]

Didn't realise you were in Australia, where abouts ?

[Qavion]

Sydney, Roger (Not far away by Concorde)