Lotus Exige Cup 380

[Vipers]

2 hours ago, The Pits said:

Who ordered Orange?

 

OMG, That made me go all funny inside, how sad is that, that just looks stunning :-)

[C8RKH]

28 minutes ago, PaulLF1 said:

Nice car, very nice but getting a bit pricey! Shame a lot of the stuff does not come as standard.

Still if Lotus sell 60 of them, a nice profit for them and more money to develop the new exige.

And the price of the exige new, can only push prices up on the older models.

If Lotus sell 60 of them, and can eek out an extra £6k profit on each one, then they make £360k in extra profit. Should just about pay for the R&D of a new front splitter on the new platform.....

 

I like this 380. The red PS one is lovely.  I don't think say £90k fully specc'ed for the performance on offer is too expensive, what else would lap all day at the times this does at a race track for the same money?  I won't buy one because I could never bring myself to put that much hard earned cash into a single car, of any make. I hope others do buy one and fully enjoy the ride.

[mickv]

I'm one of those recent 380 customers who might feel aggrieved that this Cup car follows hot on the heels of what many were saying was the ultimate Exige a few weeks ago.  But I don't feel aggrieved.  I'd have been seriously interested in the Cup if it had been available when I bought my bog standard 380, but there's enough of a price difference for me to feel relaxed about it.  Before I plumped for the 380 I was considering stretching to a MCL570, so I guess I'm one of those buyers who looks upon the 380 as a bit of a bargain, but only because I was getting anchored at a much higher level. 

When you compare a 380 with something like a 991, it doesn't look a bargain (in my eyes anyway) because it's a lot less car for the money. So when asking into the 90s for the Cup car with a few options, I think Lotus have little choice but to flag it as collectible - that will tempt some buyers.  And Lotus don't really care how the cars are used, they just need to sell them all.

I have to say that I love the look of the Cup 380 though - the more scoops and holes the better!

[Dani]

350 and 380 did not make a big different for me, but I find this car amazing.

A pity the 6700 RPM limitation which I find almost ridiculous and another thing I dont like is that this cup cars does not have  the battery cut off

Edited April 21, 2017 by Dani

[C8RKH]

A base 991 is what £80k?  The base 911S  is £90k. Then there are the "must have" extras to make sure the car holds its value and will resell. So the real price of a 991 base plus the essential extras is around £85k and the 991S around £95k.  

So, spec up the 380Cup to £86k and you have a nice car. To £95k and you have a bloody excellent car. A superb car.

Now, on the track or an early morning spirited drive in the country, which car would you rather have at these specs and price points?  

The 380, 991 or 991S?

I suspect those really in the know would only be looking at one option. The clue here is that it would not be made in Stuttgart.  

On the road, as a daily driver. Then the call becomes a little different, and I would suggest the split would be 50:50 between a liking for turnips or bratwurst. But only one of those cars would truly be "focused".

I believe ( I do not know as I have no crystal ball nor access to JMG) that Lotus has identified a niche for reasonably wealthy individuals who want a more focused, refined enough, toy.  They are willing to pay for the toy if it rewards and makes them "feel" like a racing god.  Just read Jokke's posts about how much more expensive vehicles from Porsche, Ferrari and the likes do not like to be overtaken on the track by a lowly Lotus.

These people do not care about the fact that the 991 has two extra seats in the back for the kids. They probably have a Cayenne for that already, or at least a Rangey or X5. 

I do hope this strategy is a success as we, and the world, needs lovely little companies like Lotus to be successful to provide an alternative to the bland mainstream. Here's hoping.

[SamoL]

Maybe you are comparing it to a wrong car. Porsche GT4 is a better comparison. I know they have all been sold out. But there is a new one on the way. Base price for the old one was GBP 64451. This is the car that competes with Exige. And it's getting harder and harder to justify that Exige is a better deal.

For me the important part is that on Exige the roof comes off. Not many will consider this as a big enough advantage.

[Jokke Vlo]

I am affraid this car has a better rear spoiler as the sport and more exclusive. But I am affraid that performance wise it has much to do about nothing.

Imo they are really making marketing now instead of cars. A bit more aero, yes, but the real weakness is just untouched.

 

[Neal H]

Lets not forget that it provides a viable alternative for those of us that don't want a Porsche. I don't buy Lotus because it's cheaper, I buy it because it's dynamically at least as good, it's British and it has fantastic heritage.

The fact it isn't cheaper does not bother me one jot.

[SamoL]

This is my third Lotus (plus one Caterham - which is utter crap in terms of reliability). I haven't owned a single Porsche yet. I buy cars because of their price/performance. To sell a lot of cars Lotus also needs to attract people like me. You could say I am a loyal Lotus driver, but I am not. I would buy a Porsche if they would offer better performance for smaller price. Because I don't doubt they have beaten Lotus in terms of reliability long time ago (if not forever).

[cbaileyuk]

1 hour ago, Dani said:

350 and 380 did not make a big different for me, but I find this car amazing.

A pity the 6700 RPM limitation which I find almost ridiculous and another thing I dont like is that this cup cars does not have  the battery cut off

What is the big difference? Apart from aesthetics and 30k?

[Bibs]

On 4/20/2017 at 14:40, nerobi said:

Anyone knows anything about this wind tunnel?

Lotus use the wind tunnel at MIRA. They used to use the 1/4 scale one at Imperial College in London.

In case anyone wondered, as I did, the pics were taken at Burfield Hall in Wymondham.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-29661936.html

[JayEmm]

@LF1 fairly simply because cup cars were built by motorsport, who don't exist anymore. They also had motorsport parts as standard, which this does not.

Don't get me wrong it looks awesome but I really think this is too much money for an Exige, I don't care if it costs £30k less than a 911 GT3 (ignoring the stupid price games people play with those) - there is clearly a lot less in an Exige and it needs to be significantly cheaper IMHO.

I think Lotus are diluting their own brands a little -  the Esprit "Sport" cars, especially the 300, we're really something special and I don't feel the name deserves to go on something like a basic Elise - it loses the shine.

Again, a stunning car but in terms of converting non-Lotus owners to the brand, I don't think this is it.

[Gashead1105]

Have to say James, I agree pretty much entirely with your post above. But I don't think it's aimed at the non-converted, it's aimed at the people worldwide who have already had one Exige (or more) and can afford to track a 90k car (which is what it is once you add the A/C and track pack which, per Gary's post yesterday, is clearly a cost option). There are hopefully 60 such people worldwide, in which case Lotus will sell them all and it's more profit for them to put towards the next model. All good from my perspective, even though it's too rich for me personally. I love how it looks and it's good enough to go on a teenage boy/girl's wall, so there's the aspirational element to it as well. 

Edited April 21, 2017 by Gashead1105

[vd9]

1) Gary's post yesterday is merely a printscreen of the official webpage, which by the way states Optional extras and Optional packs. Rather clear distinction to me

2) You have direct statement from Lotus that Nitrons and ARBs come as standard - " The Exige has long been regarded as delivering benchmark handling, but owners of the Exige Cup 380 can configure the set-up, thanks to the Nitron two-way adjustable dampers and Eibach adjustable front and rear anti-roll bars fitted as standard. Other racing additions include a towing eye at the front and a fabric tow strap at the rear. Buyers can also specify a number of additions and deletions, including FIA compliant roll cage, full race harness, electrical cut-off and fire extinguisher controls as well as airbag deletion and a non-airbag steering wheel"

3) Without titanium exhaust and/or rather very unusual paint requests you can't really make it £90k+ car, it is more like £85k with floor mats and aircon. Similarly specced Sport 380 will be at best £3k less and still missing many unique (non-residential) elements

Now if one wants an Exige for not much money, there is lovely new Exige S CR in Hexagon for £48k. If one wants poster-like outlandish looking Exige there now is Cup 380. Also there is an option to keep complaining that Lotus made £90k+ car, even though they did not.

 

Edited April 21, 2017 by vd9

[550superfast]

Lotus have changed their website in the last 24 hours. Track pack was stated as an option, now is stated as standard - and it should be on a Cup car.

[Gashead1105]

@vd9 great, I presume your order is in then? Congratulations.

To be clear, I am not complaining that Lotus have made a 90k car. They've made far more expensive cars than that previously and I'm thrilled for anyone who has ordered one already, it looks great and I'm sure it will be quicker in the hands of a pro driver than any other factory spec Lotus Exige that has been made. What I am saying is that, for me, having bought a high spec V6S new 2 years ago, I can't see how objectively the 50% (or near as dammit even if you are saying that it's not a 90k car) price difference makes sense. It seems to me that they are taking a big risk with pricing IF THEY THINK THAT THIS IS A CAR THAT IS GOING TO ATTRACT NEW BUYERS TO THE LOTUS BRAND. Personally, I don't think it is. I think it's aimed at wealthy enthusiasts who have already had one, two or 5 lotus from new already. eg Doc Pittenstein. Anyway, all good, I'm sure there are 60 such individuals worldwide who will order one and will get what is a fantastic looking car, which I hope to meet and chase on a track near me in the not too distant future. I'm all for Lotus being profitable, long may that continue so that they can make and I can buy their cars going forwar. But, FOR ME, THE CUP 380 IS NOT ENOUGH OF A STEP UPWARDS ON MY 2 YEAR OLD V6S FOR THE COST TO CHANGE TO MAKE SENSE. And I reckon that most of the other posters on here who have a V6 currently will agree with me. Personally I think that Hoffmans car, which I  understand can be 50:50'd, is a bit of a bargain. 

[vd9]

I'm certainly not convinced due to impossibility of taking this car to the trackdays that I am aware of. It does defeat the purpose and still loud (and quite unattractive to my liking) Quicksilver alternative or hope that someone will create something do not help as well. In this light £35-40k less expensive car that can actually be used as intended does represent a rather strong alternative...

And then there is the whole loads of excitement about the looks and belief that "the car should be red"... It is clearly not a simple puzzle. :-)

[NANO]

7 hours ago, The Pits said:

Who ordered Orange?

 

Beautiful, I like ... front ? (Of course WITHOUT red stripes / contours)

[Mark030358]

@vd9

i estimated that if I put all the extras on the cup that I put on the 380 I have ordered, combined with the lack of dealer "flexibility" on price, it would be +10k more and probably a one year warranty too.

having said that it is a lovely car, but I just can't justify that cost.

cheers

Mark

 

 

[quantum2000]

1 hour ago, Gashead1105 said:

@vd9 great, I presume your order is in then? Congratulations.

To be clear, I am not complaining that Lotus have made a 90k car. They've made far more expensive cars than that previously and I'm thrilled for anyone who has ordered one already, it looks great and I'm sure it will be quicker in the hands of a pro driver than any other factory spec Lotus Exige that has been made. What I am saying is that, for me, having bought a high spec V6S new 2 years ago, I can't see how objectively the 50% (or near as dammit even if you are saying that it's not a 90k car) price difference makes sense. It seems to me that they are taking a big risk with pricing IF THEY THINK THAT THIS IS A CAR THAT IS GOING TO ATTRACT NEW BUYERS TO THE LOTUS BRAND. Personally, I don't think it is. I think it's aimed at wealthy enthusiasts who have already had one, two or 5 lotus from new already. eg Doc Pittenstein. Anyway, all good, I'm sure there are 60 such individuals worldwide who will order one and will get what is a fantastic looking car, which I hope to meet and chase on a track near me in the not too distant future. I'm all for Lotus being profitable, long may that continue so that they can make and I can buy their cars going forwar. But, FOR ME, THE CUP 380 IS NOT ENOUGH OF A STEP UPWARDS ON MY 2 YEAR OLD V6S FOR THE COST TO CHANGE TO MAKE SENSE. And I reckon that most of the other posters on here who have a V6 currently will agree with me. Personally I think that Hoffmans car, which I  understand can be 50:50'd, is a bit of a bargain. 

Fully agree with what your saying. I'm on my 2nd Exige V6. I was one of the first back in 2013 to take delivery, then changed to another in 2015.
I paid just over £50k back in 2013, and similar in 2015, I just cant see how it can justify a near on £40k increase now.
Looks like my next move will be away from Lotus, I've paid a deposit on the new TVR that's coming
 

[vd9]

I guess that situation of Cup 380 being £10k more than Sport 380 is only possible if you do a special paint, but don't ask for a track pack and/or carbon bits on Sport 380. In which case I'd argue that Sport 380 is actually a really right car to buy as you get the components that you want in much better matching package.

It does look like in practice there is three distinctive options now:

1) If you want an ultimately track focussed Lotus car - buy Exige S or Sport 350 from dealers stock and tune it the way you like. This would get you a very fast car for probably £70k at expense of (most likely) not being able to get your preferred colour or configuration

2) If you want a really fancy and very capable car to mostly be loved and used for spirited driving - buy Sport 350 or Sport 380 in your desired configuration which is likely to include some impressive paint job or Lotus Exclusive work. This would get you a very special car for probably £80k at expense of being not able to use it in the most of the trackdays (due to either noise or really fancy paint job, which I'd personally hate to damage with chips)

3) If you want a current showstopper of an Exige that is also somewhat unique and most likely immensely capable - buy Cup 380. This will get you a special very fast car, which is a bit constrained in it's use (primarily due to noise with bets being placed on development of some solution to this)

Needless to say there is also a solution of "I want the best only", where Cup 380 with all the imaginable bells and whistles will do, then to be polished and stored in the temperature and humidity controlled garage. :-)

Edited April 21, 2017 by vd9

[SFO]

I bet the new "unique" 380 Cup parts - front wings, rear spoiler, full CF engine cover, rear bumper - are put on another Exige variant within 6 months. 

I bet the new "unique" 380 Cup parts - front wings, rear spoiler, full CF engine cover, rear bumper - are put on another Exige variant within 6 months. 

[cbaileyuk]

That's my issue with them as well. 

They make great cars but essentially nothing is really different. It's just more 'things' strapped to it. Completely agree that the look is lovely. The vents, the splitter, all really nice but what it essentially is, is the V6s from years ago. The CR, the 350, 380, cup, cup360, Hethel Edition, etc. They are all V6s as far as I can see. Nothing has really changed.

Don't get me wrong, a fab looker - but if the onlooker wants a cheap way of experiencing 'this' car - it can be done, easily for half the price of this - definitely not half the car though.

[Mark030358]

@vd9

yes, full carbon everything, track pack, paint job, trim, radio, sound proofing...  you just got to work into your price the deal you are going to get for a 380 against  a cup 380.

 

cheers

mark

 

[Dani]

3 hours ago, cbaileyuk said:

What is the big difference? Apart from aesthetics and 30k?

Aesthetics, correct.