Any advice on home CCTV?

[Loose Cannon]

The neighbourhood here has been in steady decline for years since they deigned to build a shopping centre nearby. We've had various "issues" with local and not so local yobs damaging property, ie just tonight some scum booted the front door and you'll understand I'm not feeling too good about living at chez Marky. To add insult the arsewipe local councillor thought it a good idea to plonk a bus shelter next to our house so you can guess whats coming next. I can't afford to move anywhere better and the kids give me grief about missing their friends anyway.

So, before I adopt a vigilante balaclava and bat can someone recommend a supplier out of the bewildering array of CCTV vendors?? What should I look for by way of resolution/spec/price etc? I was thinking about one at the front door and possibly one in a loftier postion to catch any passers by hurling things from afar. The at least one could be installed inside a window (do infra-red thingys work from inside?) and could be hooked up to a PC to record if thats the best way.

[Laura]

I'm afraid I can't recommended any supplier but if you're considering CCTV for your home you should read up on the legislation about it. You can't have any camera's that point to anything other than your own property for example. If you filmed people passing by on the street you could be accused of spying on your neighbours and could be subject to civil action.

I don't know too much about CCTV from a residential point of view I only deal with them at work but as I work on a residential housing development I know we've had to be very careful about the positioning of our cameras to ensure they don't overlook anyone's apartment, balcony etc. Have a read up on the Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) website for more guidance although I think if you have 3 or less cameras and are within certain usage restrictions you don't have to register domestic CCTV systems with them.

[mayevora]

at least one could be installed inside a window (do infra-red thingys work from inside?)

Sorry to hear the grief you are getting from the local chavs.

Again I'm no expert Mark, but the more visible the CCTV camera, the more the deterrant. Probably wouldn't deter any door kickers or worse if the camera couldn't be seen too easily if you installed it inside. Also as Laura has said you certainly wouldn't be able to film the outside of your property from inside.

IMO a CCTV camera has the same effect as an alarm box - if its high vis, you may be left alone and chavie might move to another property. Like dummy alarm boxes, dummy cameras are also available.

[Bibs]

Where I used to live my immediate neighbour had a key in case of emergencies, and he was quiet handy to feed the cats if we were away. I noticed after work sometimes that things seemed strange in the house so set up a webcam with some software which emailed me pics and uploaded a live video stream to a webserver if the motion detection was set off.

It turned out that he was coming into my house and borrowing DVD's and also using my bath! I confronted him after he'd been in and out of the house for 4/5 hours one day and of course he denied everything then when shown the pics decided to come clean, saying the alarm had been set off. With my alarm phoning me on activation and no calls being received, I changed the code and gave him my version of the riot act!

My point is, that a nice good quality webcam or 2 and some good software will be able to do what you need but as has been mentioned, be careful of the siting as if they are outside legislation they are worthless anyway.

[CNH]

You people sure have some crappy laws there. In the USA anything that happens in pubic view is considered fair game as one loses the expectation of privacy of acts commited in full view of the public. Of course one can not peer into windows but everything is fair game the only thing we run into is if audio is recorded along with video than it falls into wiretap laws. Too bad that there is a 3 camera limit as most small hard drive recorders are 4 camera models. For outdoor for small applications we use Pelco mini domes that have heaters in them for winter use. They are about $200-300 USD over here in the USA

Edited January 14, 2008 by CNH

[Dan]

Sorry to hear about this Mark, The latest issue of PC Pro magazine dropped onto my doormat a couple of days ago - it has a 'special feature' inside on setting up PC-based CCTV for "free". In reality, it looks at various software ranging from free to not hugely expensive, and cameras from

[wiseraven]

Sorry to hear your situation Mark. I've lived in a crumby area and it really eats into your soul. You feel powerless because you daren't do anything for fear of getting a brick through the window.

My previous house had a large CCTV camera that actually had an image burnt into it, so was totally useless for recording anything. However I was the only house on our cul-de-sac not to be either burgled or have a car break-in over the five years I was there. When neighbours were going away, they used to ask me if they could leave their car in front of my house and they were never touched.

If you're worried about the legality, you can get dummy cameras that should serve as effective deterents for the chavs. Just make sure it's one that has a visible wire so it looks convincing. The real camera I had looked very similar to the "Professional" one on that page. You're probably best not pointing it at the bus stop though - if anyone were to challenge the legality, your secret would be out.

[Loose Cannon]

Cheers for the quick replies. Yes UK laws are spineless aren't they. The house doesn't overlook anybody (which is possibly half the problem) so no "spying" problem. I have always erred away from cameras as I don't want to be regarded as the "nutter up the road", like our two genuine nutters-up-the-road, a pair of brothers who live next door to each other, who are nearer the epicentre of trouble and have gardens covered with scrap cars, are in gun clubs, and have a forest of cameras and PIR sensors. The laughable irony is the coppers rely on them for video evidence if any bother does go down! I've lived here for years, it actually used to be the quiet end of the estate and people used to moan how boring it was!

[CNH]

I use a lot of these type of cameras in my security business.

http://www.pelco.com/products/default.aspx?id=600

Check out www.pelco.com as they have a full line of HD recorders some that are as simple as a VCR or DVD recorder that are easy to operate and program with built in quad views. They sell these products in the UK. We use the camclosure domes with a smoke dome so people are not really sure which way they are pointed and some have small internal heater for low temp and weatherproof. Suface or wall/ceiling install options. There are also weatherproof bullet cams but are used for close distances if proof positive identity is required 20+ feet a hi res camera with a larger chipset must be used. Pelco site in the on line tools have calculators for the image size per distance.

Sorry to hear about the problems in a once nice area, it is a shame.

Calvin

[V8Esprit73]

Have a look on this website:

http://www.moretonalarms.com/

They may have details of somebody nearer to you.

The systems are pretty easy to set up and they can advise you on which cameras are worth buying etc.

4 channel MPEG 4 DVR with a USB port is all you really need - you can have up to 4 cameras on the one stand alone system - various sized hard drives are available and the USB port allows you to download to your computer and burn to cd/dvd.

HTH.

[Tentenths]

Mark, if you're still looking for a copy of the PC Pro article PM me your email address and I'll ping a scan over to you.

[Loose Cannon]

Thanks, have downloaded the catalogue.

Cheers James, but Dan has scanned them for me, many thanks for the offer though.

[Jonathan]

Late to this, appologies if its repeating other advice - CCTV is my bag B)

Is your old bill any good ?

Speak to them and ask what unit their audio/visual unit would recomend - thats what the police are there for.

Most places should be running a hard drive recorder, if they are like our unit they go out and download incidents so they've seen loads of different types and know which are the most preferable.

The Benefit of HDD is high resolution and good framerate / duration (usually weeks) PLUS you dont have to change tapes etc and can have multiple cameras. Thats the recorder sorted.

Cameras, OK 2 things here - deterent and evidential.

I usually recomend having an overt decoy camera and at least one covert camera. The hope is your decoy which is on show will deter the minor muppets, and if they take offence at it it's not going to cost you anything to replace (unlike a real camera) - you could make this yourself !

The covert one, just get something small and be creative.

My little bullet camera I have is extremely hi-res, colour and is the size of a lipstick - but you might want to get pan / tilt / zoom (PTZ camera as they are often called) - not sure on your requirements. This one can also be IR illuminated (IR will reflect off glass like normal light - IR is normal light, we just can't see it that well). Some cameras have IR in them, some are just really good at night by using high quality chips and framerate technology (just like a stills camera).

The idea is the twats will not see the real hidden camera and bosh - if they do something it's a criminal damage thing.

Obviously the idea of the overt camera is to stop them from doing anything in the 1st place which is the ideal situation.

Doesn't need to be expensive at all - you could probably cover anything with 1 camera giving an over view and 1 camera giving a closeup of any potential flashpoint area (ie the doorway).

Giz a shout if you're not sure.

EDIT - on the siting it's prett easy - the golden rule is anywhere which is a public place you can be photographed, end of.

The other golden rule is obtaining anything which might be determined as 'private'. As Laura says aiming it into the bedroom of a neighbour is deemed intrusive as it's not a public areas and violating privacy.

There are a few things to avoid (ie childrens play areas being one) but since you're not a company and you'd have a valid excuse to be aiming cameras onto the street you wouldnt be done for it if it was a genuine mistake. Again, any doubt, contact the police but ensure you talk to someone who knows the score, a lot of coppers think they know everything and actually know rutleys (like the PC that arrested a guy for taking still photography of his sons football match ).

Edited January 18, 2008 by Jonathan