Esprit Prices

[Roger 912]

Am I correct in thinking that Esprit prices are on the rise or have risen somewhat. I just had a look at what was offered up on Ebay and they seem rather high.

[Andy Esprit SE]

The V8's seem like there going up, weather they sell is a different story as the same cars keep popping back up.

I like the look of a 1995 N reg red V8 on piston heads with S4S spec as such, the same year car with 40k miles was about 16-17k 5 or 6 years ago when I was dreaming of buying one. ThereS a nice looking red GT with black wheels alot cheaper too so like always I guess it the right car for the right man.

I paid too much for my SE really with hind sight but that was the car for me at the time (sights set) so I wasn't leaving with out it.

[Vanya]

I'm also eyeing that V8 - although I feel its underpriced given the mileage IF it's in good nick.

 

The real question is WTF is up with S4s prices - all the bloody cars have over 70,000 miles on them and they cost a fortune. What's more, their engines are always dirty with chipped paint and I'm willing to bet my left testicle the undersides of those cars ain't much prettier. I'm more than willing to pay top whack for a good car but some dealers seem to hold prospective buyers in contempt.

 

Andy, your SE seems to be in fantastic condition (esp for a UK car) by the looks of it, so even if you overpaid, you're still a winner!

 

I agree Esprit prices are on the up as of late - Giugiaros especially.

[dodge1979]

I dont believe fleebay is the correct judgement of prices. Yes they have started to rise but dealers etc use fleebay as just another selling tool to advertise on..especially with slow moving stock. There are still a LOT of overpriced cars out there..mainly overpriced because of dealers or because of the well know. Buy it cheap realise the costs pass it on syndrome. Too many cars were bought cheap needing work..new owner realises after either the extent or cost and passes on and wants to recover the monies invested. Same issues are present but the initial purchase price has shot up. And there are still a few out there with deluded images of their car and its value..a chrome gt3 currently for example..

Genuine bargains are becoming rare because cars are either being broken for parts with no good reason other than its easier and generates more long term income than the value of the unit as a whole currently..or because the above mentioned..everyone can afford to buy but not to do scenario

[hedgerley]

I like the look of a 1995 N reg red V8 on piston heads with S4S spec as such, the same year car with 40k miles was about 16-17k 5 or 6 years ago when I was dreaming of buying one. ThereS a nice looking red GT with black wheels alot cheaper too so like always I guess it the right car for the right man.

 

If that's the one at Murray in Edinburgh, its been sold. Certainly was when I was speaking with Brandon 2 weeks ago. And yes, it is in very good condition. PH also has a 2001 V8-GT with almost identical miles to mine. Its up for £26,995. That's £6k more than I paid for mine with 25k fewer miles 6 years ago. So I guess the prices are edging up.

 

It will be interesting to see if the 2003 FE one goes for the price being asked - £59,995   

[Bibs]

Last one sold for more than that!

[dodge1979]

The FE ones price will always be detached from reality. As will early S1.

[nigeninja]

There's a nice blue S4S for sale on piston heads £21,995  

[Bibs]

Was that not a Cat D insurance write-off which should really be declared (legally so if it's a business selling it, morally so if it's a private sale)?

[hedgerley]

Last one sold for more than that!

 

Come on Bibs, spill the beans. We all want to know what it went for. I assume its back in the UK? 

 

BTW, you should tell the new owner to hook up with Gordon Masson so they can get a 'first and last' photoshoot sorted.

[Trevsked]

 

Was that not a Cat D insurance write-off which should really be declared (legally so if it's a business selling it, morally so if it's a private sale)?

 

I think you're right. I saw it and thought the same.

Trevor.

[nigeninja]

I think your right as well    

[Zolder]

I think there are 56 S4s registered in the UK, if you want one you have to pay for it (although when we bought ours, we got a bargain). 

Edited March 15, 2014 by Zolder

[Bibs]

With regards to the Azure Blue Esprit S4s reg G17 SPY, this is a trade sale and I understand that legally it should be declared as a Cat D write off. 

 

I've informed Pistonheads for them to remove the advert and will call Trading Standards on Monday to report the trader. Shame he's not being honest, looks like a nice repair and I'm sure he's still sell it if only he was telling the truth. Now it'll be blackmarked and this post should be searchable on Google in about 10 minutes by the reg.

[Trevsked]

A little honesty would be have been welcome as some looking for an S4S might travel a fair distance then finding the cars history having wasted time and money. Something like that should always come up if the purchaser uses due diligence but not perhaps until the deal is further down the line. Top money for a cat C or D.

Trevor.

[Jacques]

Seems to me too, that prices are rising. Also in Sweden and Germany where I was looking, they've gone up 20.00-30.000 dkr, since last Summer. Ebay in general just rises prices on anything, and should not be used as a general rule of how much something is worth. I do not agree with the statement, that a thing is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

There are many Things that in certain times and circumstances are not very sought after, so they drop in Price or just don't sell.

But they are still worth a certain amount. Supply and demand is not the king here.

Look at houses and paintings, for example. A so called "Expert" guesstimates what he or she thinks it's worth. But have no personal interest in buying it, but making an impression to others, that this is worth so and so much. One year a house is worth say 1.000.000 and three years after, it's worth 3.000.000. And people are willing to buy to a certain extent. This also shows sometimes in Lotus'es. Sometimes one can read that a certain car belonged to a factory emprloyee, or that ACBC laid his hand on it on an exhibition, or that it's the only one in this colour and this engine and this leather roof liner sold on this specific market. Does it make it a better car? No. But to some, a more interesting car. and that is also what the "Experts" are emptying your pockets for. They create a story that makes you think, "Oh I gotta have this one, because I'll be a very special person". Or whatever one tells himself to make the purchase justified.

I still think that we will have to get used to be paying higher prices on Lotus cars in the fture. They are after all rare, sublime, and exotic. And very cheap compared to oher cars, that have become very expensive because of speculation. That brand with the prancing pony in front for example.

Let's make a mind experiment: Let's all agree, that nowhere on this Planet there should be a Lotus Esprit sold for less than 100.000.euro. Not matter the need to sell or what ever - no less than 100.000 euro. No matter the tax systems in certain countries, like my own, in which you have to pay 100% tax on the used car you just brought from another country. So that would be 100.000 plus tax. New ones are 180% tax.

This in time, wlll make all the other people think, that they are worth this. And in time they will be. Because if you wnat one, you'll have to pay. But the real value is the same.

Sometimes Things cannot sell, because people think they a cheap thing is cheap quality or not interesting. Raise the Price, and people may begin to buy, thinking that this is a Premium thing preferably better than that of the neighbour. Look at iphones, for example, very expensive, very quickly outdated, and useless in time. Way overpriced for what is is.

In respect to my above mentioning of what something is worth, we can now think of what the true value of a Lotus Esprt really is.

For example, why is a much-labour-needing S4s worth much more than a 88 Turbo? Or a S1 so much more valuable than a late Turbo S3?

The later the better in terms of mechanical stability and certain abilities. But that is not the end of it. It is what speaks to your Heart, that will determine the Price.

The idea of taking parts from good cars and sell as spares is also valid to for example Laverda mootrcycles. Very rare and very good bikes. But Money speaks to some people, and they only go for the amount of Money they an rip out of anything.

Imagine if that was the case with paintings...

I stll think Lotus Esprit are cheap compared to the other brands, even though I paid double of the Price compared to  England. But I'd like them to stay cheap.

 

Nuff' said.

Cheers,

Jacques.

[Bibs]

The Cat D Esprit has been removed from Pistonheads already

[Laurie Cross]

I think the prices are appearing to rise quite sharply since the beginning of last year (aslong as I have been following them!)

 

Though there are some big gaps in the ranges that people are asking. s3 turbos seem to be anywhere from 10k to over 20k.

I think alot of dealers are inflating the price but I see the same cars month after month so if they are not selling whats the correct

price.

 

Im not sure about ebay when I was buying mine I bid on a few turbos on ebay that needed completely restoring and prices were going over 6,000 yet the car I bought was in good mechanical condition, could do with a respray in a couple of years and the seats could do with retrimming I only paid 8,500 for.

 

S1's dont seem to sit around for very long, everyone I have seen recently has been a restored example and seem to sell straight away for 40k or so.

[Loose Cannon]

The Cat D Esprit has been removed from Pistonheads already

 

Do you think it will just crop up again somewhere with a less recognisable number plate? Lots of blue S4Ss about!

[Bibs]

Depends on how shifty the trader is but we'll spot it I'm sure.

[Mike6]

Well done Bibs. I would hate to buy any car that had been a write off however good the repair. History will always stick with the car and it must have a massive impact on value so it doesnt take much to work out why the dealer didnt declare it. 

[pete]

also affects the insurance if not declared

[Bazza 907]

And the insurance if it is declared

[Andy Esprit SE]

They would fetch a couple of quid for that plate, I'm sure the cat d will show on the hpi for plate when it'd on the next car too, it's a bit tricky to explain if you sell your car later on so even that should be sold cheap (to me ha ha)

We had it with a used truck sold at work, fortunately the Cat D recorded date was before the 1st reg date of the truck, on a full hpi it shown it was on a car previously when the car was wrote off, still caused some Diss trust in the sale of the perfectly good truck.

[CHANGES]

The system records the Cat D on the chassis number now not the reg...

This all came about years ago when people private plated, then went back to 

reg of year to hide the total loss record..  If you private plate a car now then

return to reg of year you will get the original number plate of first registration, This

is attached to the chassis number... A private or transferable plate will only carry

history of the car first attached to with it... when transferred It is only affixed to the

chassis number of donor car by DVLA not permanent as the first registered number

now is... In the case of this reg... it should not carry the history of Nigel's old Esprit

with it if transferred..

With regard to a car being recorded or not... The industry can still be cute if in the know..

A quick repair and sale can actually beat the cat D being entered on to the system..If the

trader does an HPI on the car quickly which comes up clear and sells the car with it..

If caught out pleads ignorance and generally gets away with it... If the buyer HPI's the car

at time of purchase and it comes up clear but appears on the register later , then he or she

has recall on HPI as long as they took insurance against it... Once again the Trader walks  

even though he was aware of its history... A lot of unscrupulous traders will buy in one name

and sell in another just to cover the comeback angle from a legal standing...

The industry is a lot cleaner now with a lot more safe guards, but still far from perfect, as with

all criminals if there is a way round it they will find it..

Also don't forget the third party total loss cars, These are not recorded and a cherry for this sort

of trader..

 All of this does not mean the cars are not repaired correctly, most are , but the value should be

reflected in the sales price..  Not many salvage repair traders are rouges..just a few but the rest pay... 

If a seller knows the total loss history of a car be it trade or private they are obligated by law

to declare it... Proving they did or did not know after the fact is the problem.. He said they said syndrome.!!!!

In the case of this Esprit the pay out was £24k So the same insurance company would only value it at max 

£19K  when put back on the road if repaired correctly because of its history.. 20%  down ...

This would be unless it had independent valuation and assessment of repair quality done for the ins. co...

However the history is stuck with it for ever regardless......

So when spending this sort of cash get an independent inspection by qualified engineer if unsure... 

The irony of this is that the Esprit was a very doubtful total loss and should have been repaired, if

done that way it would have carried its insurance value and not have been recorded.. It would then

be up to the owner when selling to declare any accident damage if asked.!!!!