Seriously thinking about upgrading to an LSD

[alias23]

Two things have bugged me about the Exige since I bought it... Firstly the ride height, it's a sports car not a fiesta so upgrading to the Nitrons has fixed the 4x4 problem and after a bit more tweaking I'm sure will have radically improved the handling.

Second, is the lack of an LSD.... I don't buy the lotus story that one isn't needed, or one would negatively impact the handling. So considering the upgrade potentially for the winter.

Although need some help and advise please.

Will an LSD completely make race pack irrelevant? What would be the likely impact? Would race pack need 'disconnecting'?

I'm led to believe the install is an engine and gearbox out type of job... Do we think that's true? If so how much time and effort do we think is required?

Finally, who would be confident, competent, and trust worthy to take on such a project? Preferably at reasonable vs crazy 'prestige' rates?

Any thoughts, feedback much appreciated as I realise this isn't an easy upgrade.

Thanks

[Bloke79]

Can't offer any advice, but I will watch this one with interest

 

Out of interest, with race mode enabled, what's your concern with the current rear grip?  At some of the lower speed/tight corners at some of the racetracks here, I can out-accelerate a GTR out of the corners.

[ramjet]

If Lotus said it would affect the handling, I would tend to believe them. They are pretty good at it.

I would presume the LSD would have an effect due to wheelbase. Shorter wheelbases cars would experience understeer under acceleration in corners I would think?

I could well be wrong. I'm just putting on my physics hat. (It is quite old. 'insert zimmerframe icon')

[lotus34]

Two things have bugged me about the Exige since I bought it... Firstly the ride height, it's a sports car not a fiesta so upgrading to the Nitrons has fixed the 4x4 problem and after a bit more tweaking I'm sure will have radically improved the handling.

Second, is the lack of an LSD.... I don't buy the lotus story that one isn't needed, or one would negatively impact the handling. So considering the upgrade potentially for the winter.

Although need some help and advise please.

Will an LSD completely make race pack irrelevant? What would be the likely impact? Would race pack need 'disconnecting'?

I'm led to believe the install is an engine and gearbox out type of job... Do we think that's true? If so how much time and effort do we think is required?

Finally, who would be confident, competent, and trust worthy to take on such a project? Preferably at reasonable vs crazy 'prestige' rates?

Any thoughts, feedback much appreciated as I realise this isn't an easy upgrade.

Thanks

I would speak to Hangar 111, as it seems that Komotec Tec do an lsd for the Exige V6, and since Hangar 111 are the UK distributor they will be able to get it for you. I'm sure they would be more than happy to fit it for you too, but I would suggest giving them a ring. Their website is http://www.hangar111.com/lotus/

[Trevsked]

It seems to me you have had little response as others are perhaps like me wondering what issue you have. If there is one thing that amazes given the power of the V6 it's the way it manages to put its power down without fuss. This apart from excellent traction control (Lotus use this rather than an LSD) is partly due to comparatively light weight. If the car is light enough it will want to go forward rather than stand and wheelspin. Also your first post describes it as a 4x4 which I'm sure many will be a little bemused by. In my view unless you have exceeded the cars current power with an upgrade I really think you are wasting money and potentially causing issues that will be harder to resolve. Are you planning to race the car or is it road use? Are you getting wheelspin? What mode are you running the car in that makes you feel you may need an LSD?

I would add that when I was buying my car I thought traction might me an issue with an LSD but since owning it I've had no such problems and it seemed clear given its current PTW that the DPM is Lotus's answer to an LSD and a fantastic job it does too.

 

Trevor.

[Arun_D]

I think there's at least one V6 owner on the continent that is a very regular track goer that has done this and is very pleased with the results. Irrespective of whether this is needed or not, let's tackle your queries:

 

• I don't believe race pack will need disconnecting in a physical sense, but I'd probably be tempted to leave DPM in 'off' to avoid potential conflict between the ABS system detecting rear wheel slip and applying individual rear brakes, and the mechanical differential doing its torque biasing. You could potentially get some funny behavious/traits? Would it make race pack irrelevant? In my opinion, if you're driving the car at a level where you think an LSD will improve your performance, then maybe you're not one to be using race pack anyway, and prefer to correct the car yourself?

 

• Yes, I think it is a clam off, engine out job. This is based on my experience of having a failed clutch in my last V6. Lotus budgeted 30hrs for this job, though I understand some specialists may be able to do it quicker. For example, I think a certain independent charged or charges around a fixed £3k for an Evora clutch change, including parts, which requires the same effort.

 

• As mentioned before, Hanger111 would be a good start, being a Komotec dealer.

[alias23]

Thanks guys for all the replies especially as it's generally uncharted territory on the v6.

On the 4x4 comment what im referring to is the ride height of the standard car, for me the car was just too high for the type of car it is, since the Nitrons and lowering the car I've had unanimous feedback from other lotus owners commenting on how much better the car looks.

On terms of race pack/DPM, one of the key reasons I've got the lotus so to get back to pure driving and to learn how to be a better driver, so electronics aren't really my thing. I did use 'race' last week when it was throwing it down with rain at Combe, it did give me confidence in the extreme conditions but I could also feel it cutting power and 'kicking in'

So losing the functionality of DPM doesn't bother me too much, I just need to turn the knob full right and everything off I guess...

For me I miss the analogue control of the rear end, the back can come out but you just can't hold it there, so there just feels like something's missing.

Concour with Arun a number of guys in Europe have installed and highly rated the LSD which has sparked my interest. It's also interesting how the evora400 comes with an LSD and likely the exige400 will come with one also..

Will give hanger111 a call thanks for the recommendation.

[Trevsked]

You make a good argument for no electronics and I do agree with you but the fact that it can be turned off if you're brave enough and I seem to remember Chris Harris drifting it round Hethel kind of justifies that Lotus have not taken the skills away from the driver if he or she has enough talent. I've not searched for info on the LSD but would be interested to hear the benefits once fitted? If its an upgrade then I'm all for it.

Trevor.

[Vulcan Grey]

I installed a Quaife LSD in My 89SE Esprit, many years ago.  I had driven my stock 89SE with an open diff, back to back with my friends X180-R Esprit with a ZF LSD.  I had to have the LSD, it was so much better, much more traction, and no spinning the rear wheels out of a corner on track.

The ZF in the X180-R is a clutch type, and definitely did add front understeer in the slower tight corners.  The quaife that I installed really transformed the car for the better, and increased the rear grip noticeably, without adding any understeer in fast, med, or slow corners.

I also rode in a late '05 Elise with the Toyota LSD on an autocross course, and it definitely had more rear traction than the non-LSD '05 Elise that I drove on the road course the next day (this was last weekend). 

I think I would always prefer an LSD is possible.

Though I know the 2-Eleven, that I rode as a passenger on track with Nick Adams driving, really didn't seem to be hurt not having a mechanical LSD... the electronics seemed to do a really good job, and it felt like an LSD.

[Vulcan Grey]

to install the diff, you'd definitely need to take the entire transmission out of the car (clam off) open the transmission remove the gear shafts, and install the diff with the original crownwheel.

 

Start watching at 10minutes for the gear box assembly with the close ratio gears.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjdlCUYGlLA

[kokostrollet]

On the 4x4 comment what im referring to is the ride height of the standard car, for me the car was just too high for the type of car it is, since the Nitrons and lowering the car I've had unanimous feedback from other lotus owners commenting on how much better the car looks.

 

Maybe a stupid question, but can you adjust the ride height with the nitrons easily back up and if so, how easy is it to do, how much and how fast can you do it? One of the big advantages to me living in a city with the Exige and a big selling point is the ride height, but if it can be adjusted easily with the nitrons that would be even better.

Edited August 31, 2015 by kokostrollet

[C8RKH]

I think my mum told me she upgraded to LSD in the 60's. Not sure she's ever really recovered from the experience!  

 

[alias23]

Maybe a stupid question, but can you adjust the ride height with the nitrons easily back up and if so, how easy is it to do, how much and how fast can you do it? One of the big advantages to me living in a city with the Exige and a big selling point is the ride height, but if it can be adjusted easily with the nitrons that would be even better.

You can adjust the height of the nitrons as with most coilovers you can wind them up or down to get the ride height you want, however I wouldn't say it's a quick job as you'll have to remove the wheels, measure up, adjust the shocks, wheels back on and likely redo your geo.

So I'm afraid not an easy options. I had a cool lift kit on my last gt3 which was great for speed bumps.

Must say at my current ride height I've had little problems, but I keep away from multi-storey car parks which I guess are the norm for parking in the city.

[kokostrollet]

That lift kit thing of the 99x GT3 is what I was hoping for in a similar form. Maybe something they could consider as an option for the next Exige? Do you know how much extra weight that adds on the Porsche approx?

[alias23]

Sorry wouldn't be able to comment on the exact weight but I would have thought it would be a few kg as I understand it was operated with air pressure.

[LF1]

Any movement on this one? Winter is coming...

[alias23]

On 13 November 2015 08:21:45, T3Jn said:

Any movement on this one? Winter is coming...

House move mid December has side tracked me at the moment 

[Steve LF1]

Hi mate,

 

For what its worth to you, my exile has the komo-tec 430 kit and i broke 8 minutes at the ring this year. Also past everything on the moto gp track bar 1 gt3 rs.

 

I also turned off all electronics. Its way to invasive, although it is probably faster. But that misfire feeling when I'm trying to slingshot out a corner frustrated me.

 

You have done the right thing by nitrons for your handling. Make sure you are running troffer tyres or avon semi slicks before you waste your money on a diff. If you have these tyres, pay the extra and get komo-tec diff with down gear kit! Car is way to long geared. But has 2 final drives. 1st-4th and 5th and 6th. komo tea do a down gear kit and diff package. Thats what is next for me. If your gonna do diff. Do downgear kit too. But as i say get tyres sorted first if not done. I was managing to wash out the front on the gp track i was going so hard, but wouldn't have benefited from a diff. Rainy conditions may be different, but in the dry i couldn't see a need. Although with a downgear kit you will need it.

 

As i say I'm getting the downgear kit and up from 430 kit to 460 when it comes out.

 

Hope that helps any.

 

Steve

Edited November 15, 2015 by Steve LF1

[alias23]

Thanks Steve thats really helpful feedback. The LSD isn't just for track but also general hooning - I miss having a car that you can play with the rear end and get some side ways action  

I've been totalling up the whole install and in rough figures I'm seeing the following costs:-

30 Hours of Labour: £57 x 30 = £1,710

KT430 Kit = £4,500

Lightweight Flywheel & Upgraded Clutch = £950

Close Final Ratio Gears = £1,755

LSD = £1,400

TOTAL = £10,315

Thats a whole lot of dollar! Slightly worrying especially given its highly unlikely you'd get any of that expenditure back on resell. It does make me question a few things, one is the close final ratio really needed? Do I really need to upgrade clutch if I'm only at 5,000 miles? What do I want more LSD or KT430 if I had to choose between those two? Also with a £10k premium it does make me think do I just wait for the Exige400 but I really think that will be a £75k+ car which is beyond my budget for a track/weekend car.

Anyhow I guess with the house move approaching (growing up and getting the big house lol) I may have to wait a little longer which may be a good thing as I decided what I really want.