Problem with alternator or charging.

[CBrownstead]

Man I think these cars are beautiful, exotic, fun to drive, not fast but quick . . . but the build quality is just pathetic. I own a 1988 and a 1994 and I do see improvements. But compared to the porsche's I own, corvettes, even a ferrari, jaguar . . . I guess my friggin volvoe . . . these are all heads above this pathetic 1988 esprit. I finally got the engine running well, found the 800 different vacuum leaks, replaced little connectors, replaced the clutch that was gone by 36k miles . . . and then I have the confidence to take it on a drive through the mountains, a curvy road, 500 miles round trip, perfect for a car with the esprit's abilities. On the way back, it starts missing, more than the usual stumble at 3000 rpm, 5th gear, off throttle problem that seems to plague half these darn things. The alternator lights starts to flicker and my battery slowly dies. I get it off the road, buy a new battery, put it in, the alternator light does not light up, but the battery does not charge either . . . I mean this thing has 36k miles on it, I know it is almost 20 years old, but my God, this is pathetic. Didn't lotus take any pride whatsoever in reliability or build quality? I have a 1985 vette that has 160k miles on it, many of them track miles, and it is 10 times more reliable than this thing, I also have a 1988 a callaway twin turbo vette that is much faster on the track and in a straight line, and it is much more reliable. The jaguar XJS is even more reliable, even the fickle crazy ferrari little V8 . . . expensive, but much higher build quality and also hand built. Anyway . . . enough complaining . . . I just expect more from a car

The problem . . . no alternator light, new battery is not charging . . . car is running and starting fine. Is the alternator expensive? Surely the belt is still there, have not checked, it dyed 85 miles from home, had to rent a car to get myself and son home, now I will have to find the parts, then go fix it myself because obviously there is no dealer close by and most people wont touch them . . . I am getting the lotus indoctrination . . .

[Tony94S4]

Sounds like the same alternator problem I had on 911 turbo I drove with less then 20k miles on it,

on the boxter S cam seal leak problem than overheated engine with less the 20 k miles on it,

on 88 testarossa electrical problems on the relay panel & switches, fuel leaks, cooling problems with around 20 k miles,

don't get me started on my bmw and mercedes experiences,

I owned the esprit for 7-8 years I had clutch problems only with upgrades

to easy pull lengths on 911s or vetes

back to ur problem

if u have mechanic that serviced ur other cars should easy change it,

or u can do it to in one afternoon

U can send ur valeo for rebuild, or use it as core for the bmw bosch version I hear is better with little modifications to fit

so far my charging is good but if mine goes bad I will use the bmw bosch

thanx to Ed for the write up on the bosch replacment

here is a link to his page

http://lotusracer.home.mchsi.com/lotustipspage3.htm

good luck

tony

[CBrownstead]

thanks good link . . . I just expect the car to run for a while without issues . . . compared to my others. And I have to disagree on the porsche cars . . .they are impecable. . . I track several 930's mid 80's models, I know they called them 911 turbo but I prefer the original designation. I beat them to death and they perform like iron. As for the rossa . . . the solid feel of that car cannot be matched by any lotus esprit I have ever driven, which is all of them. The lotus is so light, but yet, it develops squeaks, squeals . . . creaks . . . you feel the road harshness up through your jaw bones . . . the testarrosa handles just as well, way heavier, way faster . . . not as quick . . . but feels like it is a much better built auto. Obviously it is more expensive. I compare the lotus esprit more to the 308 that I owned, a bit more raw, the controls, the interior leather, glass, electronics . . . etc . . but those have held their value, V8, etc . . . esprits 4 cyl . . . they should be more reliable. They just do not feel like they are built well . . . they are engineered fabulously . . . I love them . . . but they are often mistaken for a kit car for a reason . . . half the parts are not lotus . . .

I admit these cars being limited production is part of the appeal . . . but that also carries the problem of finding parts from EVERYWHERE and EVERYOTHER car manufacturer . . . it is like which one is the worst part that the original manufacturer does not want anymore.

Like I said, I love them, but show me one place on a Porsche or Ferrari that has basically a friggin metal sheet screw holdling some flimsy fiberglass piece covered with cheap carpet, to another fiberglass body peice just drilled right through the fiberlgass . . . doesn't happen. The germans would have a metal washer on both sides, with a pre-drilled metal gromlet, rubber body bushings and nickel plated bolts through to both sides, rated at 2 times the needed strength . . .that is just a fact. Porsches are built in much larger numbers and to a MUCH MUCH MUCH higher standard and build quality. But that does not make them better, just different . . .

Edited January 19, 2008 by CBrownstead

[Tony94S4]

I guess some times is luck

just like back home in the 80s my parents had

a yugo witch is known for problems

we had it for over 200k klm I don't remember

anything going wrong with it

and we had a golf diesel wich was one of the most

reliable cars and gave us hell

who knows?

I agree on the porsche its a super car

and disagree on the red head don't get me wrong I love the looks of it,

maybe even the best looking car for me,

but it was not smoother then the esprit for me,

heavier feel and not solid there was so much flex that put a hair

line crack on top of the windshield, forgot the clutch work also on it and

the front lip u guys think esprit is bad? try testarossa every little imperfection

on the road would catch

I had to fix the fiberglass couple times

I think esprit is a great car for the money and its time,

but maybe not perfect

but again that's just my opinion

and I respect yours

[CBrownstead]

You are correct . . . you cannot get more bang for the buck than the esprit . . looks or performance wise . . . it is fabulous . . .

[Advantage]

Lotus don't make alternators. Neither do Porsche or Ferrari.

[SE Owner :-D]

True! And oh so funny!

[mr.oogieboogie]

no but they do sell the parts under their brand, so i can see chris's point

[Malc Holmes]

no but they do sell the parts under their brand, so i can see chris's point

Sorry, but I dont quite see his point.

Sure I can understand being anoyed when any car fails on you, but to blame the failure of a 20 year old part (may even be the belt, its not been checked) on Lotus not taking 'any pride what so ever in reliability', its over stretching the claim some what. Does any motor manufacturer warantee parts against failure for 20 years?- No. Would any componant manufactuerer in their right mind warantee there componants for that period? No.

I am sure Chris did some reasearch before buying 2 Esprits and understands that they havent always had the best record for reliability, but that is so often de to abuse or lack of care by previous owners. I dont think a charging failure is realy such a suprise, or should be treated as a reflection of Lotus quality as a whole.

Malc

[Mark Blanchard]

Esprits . . . havent always had the best record for reliability, but that is so often de to abuse or lack of care by previous owners.

This is very true. Previous Owners often tinker around with their Esprits to save money, not knowing what they're doing and make a bad Esprit worst (then sell them on). There are no shortage of bad Esprit's out there.

[andydclements]

And at 20 years old with only 36000 miles, it's one of those things where the car would probably be more reliable now had it have reached double that mileage already.

They really seem to hate sitting around, it's almost like the car has a mind of its own, gets bored and comes up with ways to p*** the owner off as revenge for not driving it frequently.

Andy

[Guest Troy Halliday]

I have a family car here a third of the age of your Esprit that has a blown headgasket and a brocken piston crown. Oh and this is a common fault on these vehicles yet they made and sold hundreds of thousands of them and millions of the engine which has been used by at leats 4 different car manufacturers that I can think of.

Unfortunatly things go wrong with cars you fix them and move on doesn't stop them being bloody enoying though. I think Chris may have just been venting and I'm sure has packed away his soap box for the next 'Trying Times' B)

[davegtst]

Rover by any chance?

[Guest Troy Halliday]

Oh yes. Rover 75 1.8l.

Why a 1.8l well Caroline intorduced me to a new word called econa???? something or other. Thing is we both actualy like the way it drives (apart from the obvious lack of power) and the comfort. Just means I have to recon the engine. Although I suspect that the piston crown may have been the reason for the previous owner getting rid of it. A few mods to the engine should eliminate the head gasket issue but there we go all good fun.

[davegtst]

Headgasket failure is very very common for the k series engine. The v6 rover 75's seem to be ok though.

[Paula&Marcus]

Ohhhhh, welcome to the club ....

My Paula's MGF (1,8l K-series) did that TWO times !! (1. time around 30000km and 2. time at 60000km).

I took the engine out and dismantled it and measured the whole thing. The reason for the blown gaskets was a not parallel block deck (measured from the main crank bearings to the top deck height there was a difference 0,4mm). The liners stood out like organ-pipes. We machined the deck paralell to the main bearings and assembled the whole engine with new parts.

And now it seems to be fine

Aparently there was a manufacturing fault when they machined the decks. Maybe some metal chips in the machine that made a proper alignment impossible ....

Looks like the Rover-guys did not work properly. Hmmmmmmmmm ...

BTW, the 6-Cyl. K-series dont seem to have these problems. I had a 75 2,5 litre and currently I drive a MG ZT 2,5 litre (same engine) and never had a single problem with both cars ! Knock on wood.

Marcus

Oh yes. Rover 75 1.8l.

Why a 1.8l well Caroline intorduced me to a new word called econa???? something or other. Thing is we both actualy like the way it drives (apart from the obvious lack of power) and the comfort. Just means I have to recon the engine. Although I suspect that the piston crown may have been the reason for the previous owner getting rid of it. A few mods to the engine should eliminate the head gasket issue but there we go all good fun.

Edited January 19, 2008 by Paula&Marcus

[CBrownstead]

yep i was venting .. . but i do think the esprit is known to be a bit of a pain to maintain. We all know that, I alsoo agree that they should be driven. But it seems that the esprit has several inherent build quality issues that I would not expect a flagship model of the brand to have. Especially a car which you are supposed to drive somewhat "hard" and I mean that in a way that says, hey this is a sports car, it is supposed to be driven a little racier than your average chevy cobolt. This one did have a crappy previous owner, but he kept good docs. The car has had almost 14 thousand dollars of maintenance, including a full tear down valve job by a lotus dealership. All this before 25k miles . . . I would not have purchased the loti I have if I didnt love them. I do some work myself as well on the cars, and generallly they are not real hard to work on . . .i.e. see lambo or ferrari . . . you have to be double jointed to work on these . . . With the racing heritage . . . I wanted more quality.

I mean look at the solution offered by those of us who "know" these cars . . . change the part from the original brand, type, model chosen by the factory to something more reliable . . . you could say the same for the clutch in this car which is also VALEO and the brakes, the dreaded red clutch hose problem, injectors on these cars were a bit suspect, and the electronic fuel management system was a joke. The map system used, the code in the chip, the door window motors, the headlights that jump, the side markers size and shape. All cars have issues . . . ok . . . maybe not the McClaren . . . but aftermarket tunors make a living off of making cars better.

I think my problem is that I hold Lotus to a higher standard than they do, because I think these cars do not get the respect they deserve . . . I am really really dissappointed in what I have heard about the new esprit. . . I mean now, lotus is even giving up on making motors and just using the BMW 12, which is great . . . but now they are simply moving closer to someone like Shelby or RUF, or something like that. They are a chassis builder like the old days or the duesenburgs and such . . .

I know porsche does not make alternators, but you know what, give them the credit for choosing a high quality one in the first place, I mean have you ever seen the battery that comes with the 930 stock . . . high compression motor requires it, but there is no doubt the thing will start.

Now back to my issue, after putting a new battery in the car, the alternator light was not coming on, but it was not charging either . . . I am leaning towards, loose connection at the back of the starter, or slipping belt, or failing alternator that just comes and goes . . . problem is, I should probably purchase them all and change them all . . .tighten the nut i guess . . . you know I love to tinker and work on cars anyway, so this part of the deal is fun, I just wish they didnt break so far from home all the time. I guess the key is to drive them close to your house, or your mechanics house . . . ha ha . . .

This forum is great and I appreciate all the support, intellect and moral support as well . . . we are a society of glutton for punishment guys . . .

Edited January 19, 2008 by CBrownstead

[910Esprit]

Chris Chris Chris - A 20 year old Lotus is not a 'car' its a lifestyle choice.... I do have a theory though - the actual body & chassis of an Esprit are fairly bullet proofed against corrosion, and the mechanicals are very straightforward, parts generic, so maybe in another 50 years when the Ferrari and Porshe has been consigned to museums the Esprit may still be viable road transport (albeit still with a few gremlins) so maybe the Lotus will have the last laugh?

cheers Steve

[Vulcan Grey]

My Esprit went through 4 batteries in 3 years...

I thought it was shorting the plates due to high G's

It was actually the alternator not charging.

I had mine rebuilt locally for ~$100

Or you can upgrade to a BOSCH ( AL49X )

http://lotusracer.home.mchsi.com/lotustipspage3.htm

[CBrownstead]

cool . . . I still have not had a chance to excersize the car of its demons . . . i purchased a new belt, AL49X (mail ordered) and I have already purchased a new battery. I thought what the hell, I will get new ones eventually and I do not want to ever get rid of this particular car . . . so it is just an investment for the future. And you know these are relatively cheap compared to others, so spending some dollars on maintenance is no big deal . . . I love the fact that forums and users like us can share the knowledge and keep the dealers from charging us big $$$ for parts from other cars that dont cost that much. Funny, try to purchase the VALEO as a lotus part from a dealer . . .compared with purchasing it as just a replacement alternator . . . Knowledge is power . . . and so is a straight 4 with a wicked turbo and light car . . . thanks guys.

Edited January 19, 2008 by CBrownstead

[CBrownstead]

Hey guys, does anyone think that using the same pulley and fan on the Bosch AL49X would cause issues? The position is identical, and the fan looks a bit more modern and more than likely was designed to move the volume of air for the bosch unit. I also noticed when i did my removal that someone had substituted a belt that was larger than the original belt called for in the parts manual. And my Valeo was leaking that black juice onto the AC unit. I also noticed that the clearance was such that the plenum chamber was rubbing on both the alternator positive connection, not through the rubber grommet yet, but who knows about arcing and the black voltage regulator was all marred up with scratches from the plenum. . . . clearance issues . . . I am going to shim it about 1/16 inch with a washer to move it forward a tiny bit, dont think it will affect the belt . . . we will see . . .

[Jonathan]

What you gotta remember with a car this old and with the mileage is that problems will occur - there is such a thing as too low mileage unless the car has been stored in a bubble it'll probably be worse than a car with 2x 3x the distance on the clock, they need regular use.

Other thing with lotus is they often get handed bum deals - they're too small to make some of the smaller parts so they need to source them from utside and often companies down want to deal with orders of 50 when other comapnies want 50,000

When you read up on the life of the Esprit it's a miracle the car even lasted as long as it did, mainly to do with the parts availability. I have layed paws on 3 stater motors for the car, they ALL different so you have to have a little leeway for them.

Overall - really and truthfully the cars are NOT poorly put together but do often develop their own problems - due to it's construction as a highly strung sports car getting bits off and replacing them can also be a balls ache - its the offset I guess to driving eutopia B)

Look at the things Lotus did make, the body, chassis, suspension, engine (exception with the liner prob on the V8) - they are all superb.

[Stockcar44]

CBrownstead, you can have my old working Valeo if you wish. Switched to the Bosch while looking for another problem. Free, you pay shipping.

Marc in CA

[CBrownstead]

thanks . . . i have the parts now . . . just trying to find the time to put her back together again . . ..