lotus oil filters

[lostu]

Hi can anyone tell me whats now going on with the original white lotus oil filter C907E6000W just bought one from paul matty

they sent me a black coopers filter with a couple of lotus stickers on R05XO7 it saying its now the lotus original it does not look good thanks STU

[77 esprit]

Stu,

For the past three years I've been using a Mobil One MI 204 filter on my S1. Very highly regarded here. Not sure if its available where you are. Used to use a Lotus OEM filter. Always had a difficult time getting it on and off. This one works great. My 907 has nearly 40K miles on it. Oil is still copper speck free. Incidentally, I run Brad Penn 20w - 50 oil. Used to be known as Kendall Superb. Same great "green" oil.

Lyn

[Bibs]

Check with Matty's that they've supplied you a genuine OEM filter. Oil filters aren't particularly complex but since they're not an official Lotus dealer they could just be selling another filter which fits the thread.

Just to clarify, when you say it doesn't look good, are you talking cosmetically? If so, get out more, it's an engine, not a fashion show

[GordonMasson]

I spoke to Brian Angus about this a couple of years back and asked him if it was worth paying for a Lotus filter above another filter that has the same size physical and thread.

Brian told me that there may not be too much difference depending on which one you choose but the real issue is not the thread or the size that matters but the type of filter element inside.

Lotus looked at various different materials before selecting the one that would give them the optimum oil flow through the filter but still have a tight enough compound to catch particles.

I know you will always pay a mark up for a Lotus part over an alternative part and where it is something like a light cluster or a door handle etc etc etc then I am all for saving money but when it comes to things like an oil filter then I would always go with a Lotus / OEM part.

[rogerch]

Just to clarify, when you say it doesn't look good, are you talking cosmetically? If so, get out more, it's an engine, not a fashion show

Yes it is, and it should be as clean as the cat walk.

[robc]

Hi

I purchased the very same filter from lotus via SJ Sportscars, a few months ago.

£17 later a black Coopers £4 filter with lotus sticker over the brand name - nice. Classy move Lotus..

Also the coopers does not seem to have the same center anti drainage valve, a disc visible through the centre thread.

the original white and green lotus ones have this valve.

The Coopers one I recieved did not.

I telephoned Lotus and was asked to send an email ! admittedly i havent.

If Brian Angus is reading maybe he can explain the lack of valve and why the drainange valve was so important previously.

Mobil One MI 204 ? does this have the same valve ?

[Bibs]

We've had this discussion a hundred times. The anti-drainage valve cannot work in a horizontal application so it's not required, it never was and don't be surprised that a company buys in parts, rebrands them and marks them up, this is how 99.9% of businesses operate (although I will admit, just sticking a sticker on is pretty lazy!).

[superdavelotus]

Is the V8 vertical on the oil filter?

[wookiecj]

Gosh Roger, you must have a well trained cat.... mine used to leave shit everywhere. I should have called it Lotus!

[lostu]

hi to all and thanks for the replies, ok bibs i know where your coming from, but can i explain better, since day one of lotus ownership and the cost of repair i have always been advised by all the important lotus circles that in maintaining the lotus engine it you cut corners then pay the price.

my issue being if you look at a lotus engine with a cheap oil filter then has it been cared for as i`ve always been told use a proper

lotus oil filter as the white C907E6000W after all these years i`m sent a black coopers with stickers on it in silver saying lotus

would you believe it was the real thing as the oil is the main concern of the lotus staying healthy with postage i payed £25 what

would you think

thanks stu.

[andydclements]

The one you and many others have been buying for years is just a filter made by one of the major suppliers but they had to do a special run of paint and stencilling of numbers to make it "Lotus" branded. Who knows maybe the change to stickers will prevent a price rise on the item due to reduced productions costs relative to the old process.

[77 esprit]

Mobil One MI 204 ? does this have the same valve ?

Rob,

Not sure if it has the stated anti-drain valve or not. The first thing I do each time I change oil is disconnect the oil cooler lines and drain them at the cooler. After this is done, I can remove the filter without it spilling over the side of the engine. Not sure if this is the correct procedure or not. Been using it since 1977 and it works for me! I fill the engine with five quarts of oil. Start the car and run it for a few minutes. Shut off. Wait a while. Check the oil level. As I'm really not sure if the dip stick is marked correctly, having the level slightly high is not a problem in my mind. Comments are welcome though! Incidentally, I always drain the oil into a "tub" so I can inspect the residue at the bottom (if any).

Lyn

Edited February 8, 2011 by 77 esprit

[Bibs]

Here's an update from a very knowledgeable source

The Lotus Aftersales Organisation has been having supplyissues with the current Lotus Oil Filter over the last 18 months.During this period Lotus Aftersales have maintained supplyof an approved filter using alternative suppliers.

For a period Lotus supplied an alternative Lotus BrandedWhite Filter.

This Filter can be identified by a slight ‘Purple Tinge’ inthe Colour.

This Filter had an extra non-return valve (visible throughthe outlet port)

The Lotus Filter Specification (from day one on the 907 Filter) does not require this extra valve.

Further supply problems (in the last few months) haveresulted in another interim filter.

This filter does not have the extra non-return valve.

The use of this filter for a short period was necessary tomaintain supplies until the Lotus original specification filters arereintroduced.

These filters are the closest Lotus could source until ouroriginal specification becomes available.

These filters still meet the minimum Lotus requirement.

Lotus has specifications for Filter Element (Area &Medium), Valving & Burst Pressure that has been in operation since theintroduction of the 907 Filter.

Filters to the original Lotus specification are nowavailable and are being distributed through the normal Lotus Aftersales distributionnetwork.

[Bibs]

No-one has ever told you that you need a non-return valve. The physics of it being sideways negate it's effect so you can see it's not required.

This is the important bit...

Lotus has specifications for Filter Element (Area &Medium), Valving & Burst Pressure that has been in operation since theintroduction of the 907 Filter.

Get that wrong and goodnight engine I'm guessing. As you can see, they spent 18 months getting the filters back on line, a trip to a factors and asking if they've got anything that fits the thread will not be a suitable replacement.

[Bibs]

How do you know that the Lotus minimum requirement isn't better than any other filter on the market?

You're welcome to do as you wish but I'll stick to following advice from engineers rather than marketeers.

[jonwat]

The first thing I do each time I change oil is disconnect the oil cooler lines and drain them at the cooler. After this is done, I can remove the filter without it spilling over the side of the engine.

You don't need to go to all that trouble, If you leave the oil draining out overnight then the oil in the filter will drain out through the crank shell bearings allowing you to remove the filter without spilling a drop.

This method also has the advantage of allowing you to properly clean & degrease the sump plughole threads so that any thread locking compound you apply to the sump plug will grip properly, also when you pour in your new oil it won't be going into & possible warping a hot engine.

[Bibs]

On the final point, Lotus had to run a thermal shock test on the engine. This involved running it at full power for some time until the whole engine was as hot as it could get, dumping the coolant then immediately refilling with almost freezing water. The engines had to withstand this something like 100 times on the trot without any ill effects to be passed and of course they did as they are in our cars!

[robc]

frightening - 'we've had this conversation a hundred times...'

i dunno what that tells us, maybe its a confusing point or I am stupid.

I only visit the forum now and then, over for the past 2 years of wonderful esprit ownership.

Sorry not to be a 25 year die hard !

interestingly when I change the oil, after letting the engine cool for say 1 hour - no messy oil spillage.

But that was with an anti drainage valve, maybe it should be called an anti leakage valve !

I would pay an extra couple of quid just for that feature.

anyway dont get me wrong - great forum Mr Bibs.

[esprit3]

There is a court case whicth lotus are fighting at the moment where a filter was fitted to a car and failed to prime, the engine knocked a big end out when the filter was returned to lotus with a claim the filter was found to not have the non return valve in side, a subsiquent investgation reveiled some of the stock had the valve and some did not. That was when lotus hurredly sourced the black cooper filter and stuck labels on and started charging more for them I'm suprised anyone at the factory would even comment on the matter. re the quote from a good source ?. The filters are mounted on the sides so the must have a non return valve fitted, The V8 has the filter fitted verticaly so would not need the valve. someone feeding bibs a load of boloney

[Bibs]

100% it's not needed, the original filter wasn't specced with one? Care to see the original Lotus drawing from 1970, will that help you to believe?

[esprit3]

Page 4 section EA of the service notes 1980- 87 esprit book says

A full flow filterof the throw-away type ,incorporating an anti-drain back valve, is screwed onto the rear of the auxiliary housing. They would not have put that in if it was not important

Infact all the service notes refer to the Anti-flowback Valve

[Bibs]

The original drawing for the part didn't have it, the specification from the drawing hasn't changed. Again, 100% it's not needed. As it happens, the spec'ed filter ended up having one but ITS NOT NEEDED, REQUIRED, NECESSARY etc.

Wanna carry on, I'm here all week?

[esprit3]

There appears to be a confusion between the non return valve and the pressure releave valve as seen in all filters mostly at the bottom of the filter and laterly at the top near the threaded plate ,the non return valve is situated behind the holes round the outside this rubber flap for want of a better description and was specced right from the word go 1970 the bypass valve may not have been. you need to understand how thease things work before commenting

[Advantage]

Geoff, without appearing to be rude, the comments Bibs is passing on are from someone who has been employed at Hethel for over thirty years, primarily involved in all aspects of the Esprit's powertrain development. If you phoned the factory for Esprit technical advice, then no doubt it would be his extension that would ring.

You can trust the advice and the source.

[lotus4s]

Geoff does bring up a good point that Lotus does specifically mention the "anti-flow back" valve for the filter info (and not much else) in every manual that I have back to 1980.

And to say that the anti-drainback valve doesn't work in a horizontal application like the Esprit is just not correct. If you do a little research you'll find that's what the valve was specifically designed for, to keep the filter full and hinder drainage from other parts of the engine to aid in reducing the amount of time it takes to fill the filter and reach the valve train components on start-up. A vertically mounted filter has much less need for the valve than a horizontal or inverted mounted filter.

It won't keep the filter from draining 100% indefinitely but depending on the quality of the filter and valve design it will certainly increase the amount of time it takes to drain the engine oil passages and filter. If a car has sat for days then the point may be mute but if for a shorter period of time like restarting several times in a day, then the benefit of the valve is certainly recognizeable.

***One other point, I just re-read Bib's post containing the response from Lotus about the oil filter in question in the original post.

The Lotus response doesn't say that no anti-drainback valve was required for their filters, it says that the "extra non-return valve" in the filter in question was not required indicating that there were two valves on some filters that Lotus provided at some point.

At least I believe that's what it says?

Edited February 10, 2011 by lotus4s