An idea for rusty petrol tanks (or not rusty infact!)

[molemot]

It isn't a "Workshop Manual" per se. It's labelled "Servicing Notes"...and is intended as information for a skilled mechanic, giving details that are specific to the Esprit. There is nothing whatsoever in there about fuel tank removal!!

 

When I changed my tanks for alloy ones, I found that it could (just!) be done without removing the engine, but it did need to have the left hand side engine mounts undone and the engine angle adjusted....once you get stuck in to the task it becomes clear. I would advise doing it when you have the engine out for some other reason...and there's loads of stuff you have to remove to do the job; seat belts, fuel fillers, vent pipes, engine bay sides, the support brackets for the body sides by the fillers, most of the cursed rivnuts.....ooooh it's fun.......but once you have alloy tanks you shouldn't have to do it again. The original steel tanks have baffles in them which means that trying to do anything chemical to the insides is problematic....you can't get the stuff everywhere it needs to go!!

[fflyingdog]

Aluminium does corrode,it depends how it is protected to start with,usually aircraft have a Dinitrol type barrier (think Waxoil) but if corrosion can find a way in it will..Stainless steel may be a way.

[Chillidoggy]

Or plastic?

http://www.tek-tanks.com

[Stimpy]

Aluminium protects itself by forming Aluminium Oxide - ironically the Aluminium version of 'real' rust (FeO2).

 

The chap that my (difficult) stuff said that one tank is engnie out (LHS) the other does not (RHS) but I can see how - effectively - loosening the whole engine can make the job do-able.

 

In 'the olden days' I remember that it was always said that Esprit cam belt changes needed engine removal - of course we know different now.

[Stimpy]

... just to be a bit controversial (and probably annoy some people) - but there MUST be value in getting kurust on to those tanks - even via a 'cover-all' spray.

 

There are holes at the bottom - as has been said.  So sticking a pipe up there with an Fe2 -to- Fe3 comverter and randomly spraying the bastards all over the shop will arrest rusting and alter the rust and turn it inito something actually harder.  Ok - it leaves the metal bluey black but - hey - its well out of the way.  The 'con' would be the expense of the product and the way the spray would be dispensed in such a random and plentiful way.  The 'pro' could be to add years onto those tanks.

 

Bear in mind I'm talking about rust CONVERTERS and not rust EATERS.

[Bibs]

You'll be spraying the foam and that's not rusty.

[Stimpy]

That's the point - you'd have to over apply the stuff and drench the area.  Waste and cost but perhaps buying time

[Bibs]

But you'd soak the foam, then it would drip back out of the hole you sprayed it in through.

 

Honestly, live with your tanks. If they need replacing, get them replaced when the time comes.

[lotus4s]

Once you take your tanks out, you'll understand why your idea will not work, it will just end up making a huge mess for the next guy that does take them out to deal with...

[rizla603104]

I really wouldn't spray stuff all over your car. It will make a terrible mess and you could end up messing something else up in the process. Save up and do the job properly - would be my suggestion.

[molemot]

The tanks rust where they sit on the foam. All the spraying in the world isn't going to get whatever you're using between the foam and the tank..and the tanks have usually rusted to the foam by now, anyway.

[mdw]

At the point you have to do it...................  JUST DO IT.  It will take a lot less time than all the worrying about it and trying to find short term easier ways to solve the problem.  Then you can sleep easy knowing you will NEVER have to take them out again and whats more its a major selling point when you come to move it on. 

[Stimpy]

Although I respect your opinions and despite the fact that I will most probably follow them (ie not do it) allow me to play devil's advocate for a moment:

1) The rusting usually occurs at the bottom of the tanks (confirmed by Taff)
2) The 'bright idea' (ahem) of putting something that holds on to water (ie spongey material) at the bottom of the tanks exacerbates (or even causes) the problem
3) The most accessible area of the tanks is the bottom (due to access from underneath)

And therefore (and here’s the devil’s advocate speaking…):-
One could:
1) Make sure the water trap (absorptive material) is dry , or help it to dry somehow)
2) Use a very ‘thin’ rust converter fluid - one that I discovered online which is bloody easy to use   (by which I mean stuff that has the same consistency as milk - and therefore NOT waxoyl which is  sticky and easy to accidentally paint the stuff where you want to use it.
3) Spray the thin stuff at the bottom o the tanks in order to ‘attack’ the area on the tank itself   
4) Almost deliberately soak the ‘sponge like’ material with the result substance effectively making it ‘paint’ the tank above it while it’s still damp and then understand that rainwater will eventually replace it.
5) Even after (4) the tank metal that had rusted will be Fe3O2   which can’t go back to Fe2O2 (rust).
The final Devil’s advocate view….  prevention is better than cure  :-)

So - as I said - I’m probably going to leave it and attend to it when necessary.
Final thought on new tanks that are metal - probably worth painting with a rust-proofing stuff before installing.

 

[Bibs]

That's should stop the aluminium from rusting nicely, good job

[Stimpy]

Regarding places/stores to go to on the internet for bits and pieces for our cars I had to learn the best places to go for Stag stuff - eg, Rimmer brothers, EJ Ward, etc.  With Rimmer Bros you get what you ordered the very next day (they're unbelievably quick).

 

So far I've learned about PNM and lotusbits, and one called 'scparts' or something - please could I ask people here- what are their favourite places to go when in need of bits and pieces?

 

Thanks

That's should stop the aluminium from rusting nicely, good job

I was under the impression that they are not Aluminium

[Bibs]

http://www.thelotusforums.com/reviews

 

The ones in there are steel, you'd be mental to replace them like for like when there are aluminium ones readily available and cheaper. That's been mentioned in the thread many times I'm sure, if not on this forum hundreds of times. 

[pete]

UK Sportscars?  

[Bibs]

Eh?

[Stimpy]

Once you take your tanks out, you'll understand why your idea will not work, it will just end up making a huge mess for the next guy that does take them out to deal with...

 

Next guy?

 

You'd have to prize my fingers off the thing and rip my nails off in the process to have it taken away from me.  Heroin would be a cinch to give up compared to 'loss of esprit'

 

(apologies to anyone reading who has had to go through the proess of coming off heroin - I've been told it's rather moorish)

re - replacement with Aluminium tanks - yes I agree, a no-brainer.

[Chillidoggy]

If I had the choice, I wouldn't mess about with aluminium, or rust-proofing the old tanks, I'd go with new original tanks, but galvanised.

 

Not that I'm aware they're available, but just saying.

[Bibs]

Aluminium is lighter and won't corrode. It's about a million times better idea than steel tanks.

[Vanya]

Regarding places/stores to go to on the internet for bits and pieces for our cars I had to learn the best places to go for Stag stuff - eg, Rimmer brothers, EJ Ward, etc.  With Rimmer Bros you get what you ordered the very next day (they're unbelievably quick).

 

So far I've learned about PNM and lotusbits, and one called 'scparts' or something - please could I ask people here- what are their favourite places to go when in need of bits and pieces?

 

I've bought most stuff from SJ Sports Cars - excellent online store, fast service. Wouldn't recommend too many of their pattern parts, but they do stock most genuine bits, while remanufacturing a lot of old stuff (i.e. wind deflectors etc etc)

 

Lotusbits are also pretty good.

[Chillidoggy]

Aluminium is lighter and won't corrode. It's about a million times better idea than steel tanks.

Aluminium won't corrode? Are you sure of that one, Bibs? In my experience it corrodes quite nicely, especially in the salt-laden air we have around these parts. Galvanic corrosion can be a particular problem around the steel/alloy interface of fastenings. But for sure it would be interesting to see how the alloy tanks fare after a few years, though. Not that anyone's going to just pop them out for a look, from what I've read it's a right ball ache job!

[Bibs]

Compared to mild steel it won't. If you're worried, spray some ACF50 on it and Duralac where there may be any bimetallic interfaces (which there aren't on fuel tanks). It's still 1/10th the weight of the steel tanks. 

[MrDangerUS]

 

Aluminium won't corrode? Are you sure of that one, Bibs? In my experience it corrodes quite nicely, especially in the salt-laden air we have around these parts. Galvanic corrosion can be a particular problem around the steel/alloy interface of fastenings. But for sure it would be interesting to see how the alloy tanks fare after a few years, though. Not that anyone's going to just pop them out for a look, from what I've read it's a right ball ache job!

 

Use Alloy 5052 or 5058 to make your tanks. Those are corrosion resistant. Salt water marine tanks are made of this stuff.

Alloy tanks will save weight nicely,(16-20 lbs depending on the gauge of the matal).

Edited July 6, 2014 by MrDangerUS