VW faking emissions tests in USA?

[Andyww]

The 2018 Renault Scenic even looks better than the new Discovery. Maybe the diesel thing might signal the decline in the fad of the SUV and rise of the MPV, a format which has always been thought of as totally uncool. If that happens, JLR have a big problem.

[C8RKH]

JLR's woes will someway been done to the speed at which they are trying to grow, coupled with their Indian owners trying to milk the cow and bottle the cash as quickly as possible.  This will put a strain on manufacturing (of the cars but also on the component makers) which will impact on quality. The shared use of components etc. will mean issues could and will spread from model to model.

Let's hope that lotus does not get caught up in a similar "rush" with Geely and the next gen of cars are a step forward rather than a step back. Change is not always for the best.

I'd still have a Range Rover Vogue though. Buckingham blue with ivory leather interior please!  

[pete]

12 hours ago, andyj007 said:

 

the designer and management FOOk up, its the workers that get sacked.....  nothing new here ..

 

 

 

 

 

Not sacked. They were all temporary workers taken on for the short term

[PaulCP]

Well JLR, maybe time to look at the mirror and see the real image rather than looking through the mirror Russian style & seeing what you want to see.
In a world where not many take responsibility for their own actions JLR now seem to be high on the list!
Honest guv, it’s everybody else that’s at fault not us  

2 examples, the Discovery Sport has suffered from issues with welds coming undone on the B Pliiar and in real world driving the 2.0 diesel requires a service every 7000 miles due to diesel contaminating the oil during DPF regenerations because of a design error in the layout of the exhaust system. JLR continue to build the cars complete with these faults and have tried to blame driving style as the reason for the oil dilution whilst many of their useless arrogant dealers try robbing off customers by saying the car just needs a software update. JLR have now admitted their mistakes but those owners who did not push the “reject” button soon enoughare left with cars that will no doubt depreciate like hell once out of the warranty period.

2018 Model year Range Rover Sports were delivered to customers with known software faults which JLR have acknowledged and told owners that they will produce a fix soon (3 months ago).

Trailng through the forums it is plain to see that many, just like me, have owned LR products for quite a few years and that they, just like me, have now dumped them whilst residuals are reasonable and switched to other brands. They are loosing repeat customers hand over fist at the moment and spending a fortune on rejections and warranty repairs.

Sorry LR, the situation is entirely of your own making. Maybe now you will start to realise that you cannot continuously turn out crap quality and then show the arrogant contempt towards your customers that you do.

 

[Andyww]

Quality issues seem endemic though. The BMW Mini has had many serious issues in the past few years with one particular engine version suffering catastrophic failures. My wife had one and it was dreadful, some of the fittings were so poor they started to fall off, and it developed so many faults we eventually traded it in. 

She got a Swindon Honda Civic which has the best design and build quality of any car I have ever driven. Not sure how the Japanese can do it in British plants while others cant.

[PaulCP]

16 minutes ago, Andyww said:

She got a Swindon Honda Civic which has the best design and build quality of any car I have ever driven. Not sure how the Japanese can do it in British plants while others cant.

Yep, after years of JLR products I’ve now moved to a Lexus and, whilst not UK built like the Civic, the quality of materials and particularly how it is screwed together is light years ahead of JLR.

Dealer also seems to appreciate the business, unlike JLR dealers who want to make you believe that they are doing yo a favour

[oilmagnet477]

JLR turning out unreliable crap and the Japanese delivering quality products?

Feels like the 70s all over again!

Visited the Gaydon British motor Museum on Thursday - a fantastic experience only slightly tempered by what we have lost over the years.... (I will be posting a thread with some photos when I get them sorted).

Have been a Landy fan all my life - it depresses me that such good looking cars can still be produced with SOOOOOO many issues. How is it even possible for cars produced today to still suffer brake pipe corrosion (and on a £70k car)?

[Kimbers]

I always thought Land Rover/Range Rover products were over hyped. There have been better products from elsewhere aat a fraction of the cost for many years. I think their new Disco proves they have lost the plot!

 

Many other brands are now out Land rovering Land rover, some are not 4x4's I know but with emissions now going "Real life"  you will see a huge decline in 4x4's. 

 

[C8RKH]

My wife is on her second brand new Qashqai. She got the Tecna (electric everything, driver aids everywhere, glass roof, leather etc.) for £24k brand new with the 4wd system.  They are brilliant cars and in this guise a 1/3 of the price of a Discovery which is not better made nor more reliable etc.

We travelled in it last month from Perth to Manchester in the heavy snow storms. At one point the snow was 3 foot deep and we were the only car moving and going south on the M74 in the snow and you could just about see the central barrier top.  The car performed absolutely faultlessly and got us into manchester safely in white out conditions going over the SHAP on the M6.  Brilliant value for money and proof of your well made point Tony.  JLR needs to realise the world has caught up and overtaken them.

[Kimbers]

With you on that Andy. Wendy has a Kia Sportage and during the same storms she carried on doing her job. Only time I had ti recue her was when so many people had got stuck she couldn't get through or go back! She loves the car and I pay £210 a month for it with no deposit..........absolute value for money 100%

[C8RKH]

I keep trying to get Maggie into the Kia Sportage - great looking cars and 7 year warranty and all - but she likes the Qashqai and you know how difficult it is turn a wife! (not literally of course!)

[Bibs]

Daimler recall 774,000 cars...

https://www.am-online.com/news/car-manufacturer-news/2018/06/12/mercedes-benz-recall-targets-774-000-vehicles-with-diesel-emissions-shutoff-device

[silverfrost]

Very cheeky !  I think this will be just the tip  of the iceberg, other brands to follow shortly. .....

Discusting even more so  due to how carsanagnetic oil burners are !

[Spinney]

This new technology that's been developed at Loughborough University could potentially delay the demise of the diesel engine:-

https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/cars/935485/diesel-cars-UK-technology-remove-emissions-pollutants

For commercial vehicles there is very little viable alternative to diesel at present, so this technology could be a godsend to manufacturers and can even be scaled down for cars. I've read elsewhere that it could be in production within 2 years, but that timing may be a tad optimistic. Either way, it is an exciting British invention (which will probably be lost to overseas companies, following the usual trend) that may well extend the life of diesel.

[pete]

VW in Germany have been fined a billion euros over the diesel scandal 

Small change in comparison to America for which they have set aside 30billion dollars

Edited June 13, 2018 by pete
Change wording

[C8RKH]

The executives responsible need to go to jail. End of

[100th_Idiot]

On 12/06/2018 at 15:37, Spinney said:

This new technology that's been developed at Loughborough University could potentially delay the demise of the diesel engine:-

https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/cars/935485/diesel-cars-UK-technology-remove-emissions-pollutants

For commercial vehicles there is very little viable alternative to diesel at present, so this technology could be a godsend to manufacturers and can even be scaled down for cars. I've read elsewhere that it could be in production within 2 years, but that timing may be a tad optimistic. Either way, it is an exciting British invention (which will probably be lost to overseas companies, following the usual trend) that may well extend the life of diesel.

That's at least 10 years from production. It is still just in promising research phase so it will need to be productionised and then intercept car manufacturers development schedules with all of their reliability testing.

[Bibs]

Audi CEO arrested...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44517753

[silverfrost]

Looks like that techy guy will not be getting used as the only fall guy with all this lot then ! 

The damage to public health is simply discusting it is about time the headsheds got pulled for this scandal.

Vorsprung duch Technic !

[comem47]

The way that Trump appointed the fox to guard the hen house with EPA, and following his recent actions, not only would he pardon the VW exec but also give him a medal !!!

 

and the beat goes on .........

[Jacques]

About time.

And then we need the other Guys from the other manufactures to be kept responsible in a similar manner.

The small fees that the EC are handing out in comparison the the US, doesn't really match the damage they've done. I say make them so huge, that they won't ever do something similar again.

Kind regards,

Jacques

[silverfrost]

Yes the United States do not mess about,  but at the other end of the stick they absolutely took the pee with the BP oil disaster.  

[Bibs]

€800m fine for Audi...

https://www.am-online.com/news/car-manufacturer-news/2018/10/16/audi-fined-800-million-euros-for-breaking-emission-laws

[LF1]

On 19/04/2018 at 09:54, C8RKH said:

My wife is on her second brand new Qashqai. She got the Tecna (electric everything, driver aids everywhere, glass roof, leather etc.) for £24k brand new with the 4wd system.  They are brilliant cars and in this guise a 1/3 of the price of a Discovery which is not better made nor more reliable etc.

We had a Qashqui while our second Disco 4 was being repaired from an accident (the other modern car looked like it had been through the crusher while the Disco was driven to the paint shop to have a bit of wing resprayed - if i had children I know where I'd rather they were). We had to do serious miles in it, oh how I could not wait to get my "crappy" Disco back. The quality of the finish (leather, buttons, dash, etc - not the build quality of which i cannot speak) was just horrible, it was an awful place to be - I'd paid for a VW Golf hire car because I wanted one, they'd "upgraded me" to the Quasqui... I begged them to downgrade me but there were none available.

We've done 50k in that disco in the past 2 years (mainly towing), been caught deep in the alps in a blizzard, passing endless cars that had buried themselves in the road side drifts, dragged cars out of danger last winter's snow storms, use it as a daily driver and never had one moment's trouble with it.

Not convinced a little family soft roader and a Disco are exactly in the same league for price comparisons... but each to their own. I suspect it's like owning a Lotus, most people must think you're completely mad, but those that own one know exactly why you'd  have one over other options.

[C8RKH]

Interesting @LF1 - my mate just handed back his 3 year old RR Vogue as the interior was in his words starting to look tatty and fall apart already. He was not impressed. I would expect the Qashqai to feel "crappy" over the Disco given it was a third of the price. You would have likely lost the value of the Qashqai in depreciation in the first year on the Disco. Comparing the fit and finish of those two cars is a bit like saying an Exige 350 interior is shite compared to a DB11. Doh, of course it is and look at the 3 times the price difference

The Disco4 is built like a truck but stiull suffers from the usual JLR quality/reliability issues. The Crapqai does have its issues but touch wood, we're on our second and nothing has ever gone wrong in either car. I guess Geordies just build better cars than Brummies!  hahaha

I get you re the crash resilience of the Disco. Is that why some people who drive them and RRovers behave like complete tossers and put other road users lives in danger as they are so "safe" themselves?  Note, I said  "some" and not "all".

If you recall last winter (around March) the weather was absolutely atrocious. Well, my wifes Crapqai was the ONLY car actually travelling south in the snow drifts (the rest were stuck!) on the M74 through the night. You could not even see the central reservations as they were buried in the snow. On that 290 mile journey in totally atrocious weather including 4ft snow drifts and white out driving conditions over SHAP on the M6, the car was perfect. as we had a plane to catch in Manchester to go on holiday and we were not going to miss it.  I never tried to pull anybody out in it as I was too selfish and wanted to get to Manchester for the flight, but it was on its standard road tyres, not "off road" tyre and never missed a single beat and got us there in one piece.

Now as a result of that epic drive I would not presume to say my wife's Crapqai was better than your Discovery. But I will say it got us there when many other vans, trucks, cars and 4x4's were abandoned on the motorways. So given that, for £24k it was and is an absolute bargain and hugely capable in my humble opinion. We don't have any snotty little kids to transport in it, nor shit machine dogs or any other livestock, so it is in fact just what she needs and fits the bill perfectly as we don't need a vehicle the size of a Disco.  We did consider an Evoque but the reliability issues put us off even more.

I have been in several Disco 4's (they all the rage up here in rural Perthshire with the RRover's and every poor farmer seems to have two), but usually leave them feeling sea sick! 

Anyway, glad you were all safe in your smash. That the Disco was fixed and you're pleased with it. We'll keep the Crapqai though thanks.