Giugiaro & Stevens Esprit Turbo 321 Stainless Steel Manifold Group Buy

[stephenwhyte]

11 hours ago, Sparky said:

Stephen - yes, much the same, but the older they get, the tougher they are!  on a G it's very likely you'd need to remove the towers, if the manifold is original.  patience, perseverance and sheer bloody-mindedness...

Forgive my ignorance but what are "the towers"? Not that it will make a huge difference to me to know but it would be nice to know what to expect to see when they start the work 

[Sparky]

Sorry - camshaft towers, or carriers.  The two bits with the red (or black, or whatever) covers over them.

[Jacques]

I too, ground Down a ringspanner. Some I took off from below, sitting either facing rear end of car, or front end of car, to get my arms at a good angle. A few I took off from above. And took the enginemount heat protection off as well. Took long time, but was easy enough. Bibs mentioned my writing on my Stevens car in the above.

Thing is, don't expect to spin a nut a lot at a time. I could sometimes only do 1/16'th or 1/8'th of a turn, before taking spann off, and reposition. Some you'll be easier off looking at first, then move yourself into position and do the nuts in blindness. Easier really. Some are visible and easy to undo. All the nuts on my car came off easy, and with that in mind, you can save some hours of grief, and I can say it will take 2-3 hours first time, maybe 4. Now? 1 hour job. I was sitting on a small chair in a pit under the Esprit.

Note: I now use the supersplendid K-Nuts in the high grade version. Smaller, lighter and does not fall off or loosen. And you can use a smaller ring spanner (11mm I think I used), plus a small 1/4" socket set.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[DaveS4s]

Where did you get the K-Nuts, what size is needed? Thanks Dave S4s

[DJ Bob]

When my new exhaust was installed we found out the pipe going from waste gate to the muffler wouldn't fit. A new pipe had to be created by using the ends from the supplied pipe and some other stuff to make a new pipe. It might not be as pretty looking as the original pipe but nobody will see it.  

Thanks Leon for the exhaust- my car sounds better and seems to run better. While working on the exhaust we decided my next project will be giving the metal frame holding the radiator fans some much needed attention.

[Zig]

On 11/22/2016 at 07:27, DaveS4s said:

Where did you get the K-Nuts, what size is needed? Thanks Dave S4s

Dave,

I ordered the  High Temperature, silver plated ones from Demon Tweaks  http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/

Product Code	Product Description	Quantity	Price	Line Total
GODHM41-100	Demon Tweeks Metric Hi Temp Aerospace Locknut (K-Nut) M10 x 1.50mm	4	£4.37	£17.48
GODHM41-080	Demon Tweeks Metric Hi Temp Aerospace Locknut (K-Nut) M8 x 1.25mm	12	£2.14	£25.68
Economy Tracked				£6.46
Net				£49.62
Vat				£0.00
Order Total				£49.62

 

You need 12 M8 X 1.25 mm to bolt header to head.  The 4 M10 X 1.50 are optional for bolting turbo to header.  

Zig

Edited November 23, 2016 by Zig

[Zig]

[Jenna'sEspritTurbo]

Hi all,, Its been some time since I posted here. I still maintain an active page on Penelope's progress on Lotus Talk. A bit of a chore maintaining two pages.

I bought the G car complete system in 3 inch. We finished opened the box when it arrived and everything appeared in order except for the muffler which was longer. We completed the interior headliner project and fron and rear camera install and then went to the exhaust install. We did everything in frame. My hands have the carnage to prove it, It took three weeks working when there was free time and got the headers on in place. Next came the remounting of the turbo and the hanger brace with shield. We removed the pollution air pump prior to install so that everything was the same as the cars across the pond. Problem came when we went to fit up the exhaust pipe from the turbo out through the wheel well. The new pipe is 3 inches shorter then the old one and will not fit to the turbo through the wheel well. Today we are getting an exact measurement and checking the dump valve distance also for possible length issues. That leads to the rest of the pipes. The muffler it appears might be for a Stevens body car which does not have a recessed battery box. I think that the battery box can be cut out and moved upward to make clearance as a last resort. I contacted Alunox yesterday and they haven't responded yet. Has any one else run into this problem???

[jcslocum]

Jenna is getting no HELP from Leon or Alunox. What they shipped to her is basically a Stevens system that won't fit. After spending BIG $$$ for the system, she get zero support from the vendor. Leon and crew deserve a big BOLLOCKING for this. I'm writing to Alunox today to show my displeasure and I hope you all do to.

[silverfrost]

Very sorry to hear about Jennas problems with the product she ordered, I hope if the part turns out to be incorrect, they do the right thing and replace it as soon as possible 

[Zig]

Alunox design of the latest version of Esprit Exhaust Manifold with CNC'd flanges they should be proud of. 

So far we only run into documented fitment problem on  Bob Moore 83 Esprit and Jenna 83 Esprit.  

Can Mark Kassim intervene and assist in resolving Jenna fitment problem?

Mark was the driving force in organizing this group buy and providing status updates on the project, so it seems that he has an established working relationship with Leon.  

I would think that Leon would actively try to resolve the fitment issues and protect Alunox name and the record of their engineering abilities from any negative feedback (which tends to stay on web forever) and may impact future business opportunities. 

Hopefully Alunox will step up and honor their warranty (though the warranty has been reduced from 2 years  of last group buy to 1 year this time).  

Zig

Edited February 10, 2017 by Zig

[Jenna'sEspritTurbo]

On 11/12/2016 at 05:13, stephenwhyte said:

Forgive my ignorance but what are "the towers"? Not that it will make a huge difference to me to know but it would be nice to know what to expect to see when they start the work 

When I refer to Towers I mean the upper fixture where the shock mounts to the car on the high side. The exhaust pipe wraps around over the top of this mounting area.

Edited February 10, 2017 by Jenna'sEspritTurbo

[silverfrost]

The upper back bone of the chassis  drivers side 

[Jenna'sEspritTurbo]

Bob's problem is not Alunox fault. He has a larger garret turbo that was not supplied by the oem and an adapter for the waste gate return mounted to the turbo before the exhaust pipe fits. The pipe supplied from the turbo adapter out on his car looks very much like the Stevens pipe and in his case that works because of the adapter for the wastegate return setup. That is not Alunox fault. My exhaust pipe is the 3 inch version and it is just short. The wastegate return would not fit paste the body in the wheel well on the forward side of the opening. I cut 2.5 inches of fiberglass away to get it in. I am having a welder here modify the pipe to get it past the body and into the wheel well. Bottom line was the pipe was cut wrong and somebody blew a measurement. Period. The muffler and exhaust elbow they sent me hits the battery box which is recessed in the body. I don't think the battery boxes in the UK cars were up high like the Stevens cars are. I don't see Lotus using a mold for the US and one for ROW. The headers are indeed nice and that is about where this whole train wreck ends. Mark and I have been talking.

 

 

9 minutes ago, silverfrost said:

The upper back bone of the chassis  drivers side 

Exactly

Edited February 10, 2017 by Jenna'sEspritTurbo

[MarkKassim]

Hi ,Jenna and I have been talking and trying to get to bottom of whats different between her car and the UK G car. This is a picture of Jenna's actual system fitted to the UK G car before shipping.

I have been in touch with Leon about this, and whilst Alunox may have been slow to respond they have been looking into the issue trying to get some information if there is a different G car body shape for the US market. The system fitted above passed quality control and is correct for a G car in the UK. We think this could be the variation for the USA Turbo HSI which was fuel injected.

As you can see its got different components to the UK G car. I believe Jenna has someone to make modifications to her system extending the exit pipe of the turbo by 3" to allow the bend to clear the wheel arch. Which leads us to believe the wheel are moulding is different as well. Jenna if you are stuck for pipe of the correct grade and size to insert , I can try and see if Alunox will send you some off cuts. I can be a go between if welder needs any information.

Mark

[Jenna'sEspritTurbo]

38 minutes ago, MarkKassim said:

Hi ,Jenna and I have been talking and trying to get to bottom of whats different between her car and the UK G car. This is a picture of Jenna's actual system fitted to the UK G car before shipping.

I have been in touch with Leon about this, and whilst Alunox may have been slow to respond they have been looking into the issue trying to get some information if there is a different G car body shape for the US market. The system fitted above passed quality control and is correct for a G car in the UK. We think this could be the variation for the USA Turbo HSI which was fuel injected.

As you can see its got different components to the UK G car. I believe Jenna has someone to make modifications to her system extending the exit pipe of the turbo by 3" to allow the bend to clear the wheel arch. Which leads us to believe the wheel are moulding is different as well. Jenna if you are stuck for pipe of the correct grade and size to insert , I can try and see if Alunox will send you some off cuts. I can be a go between if welder needs any information.

Mark

MARK,

 

 The wheel well arch is different and very open in this picture. What year is this car?? Unless that was cut out mine is much smaller. My arch opening is basically a half moo opening. Not sqaured off like yours in this picture.There appears in your picture for there be two layers in the upper arch. I don't have that. The pipe I have bought already and shipped from California. Its all at the welder and I waiting for him to tack it together so I can do another fit up test before he welds it all in permanent. I will send you a picture of my arch with the cut out piece missing to your email address. This picture shows why I had to cut my arch open on the front/forward side of the wheel well. If I tried to go straight in with the adapter on or off, I would be hitting fiberglass on the waste gate pipe.  One issue appears to be solved. But not the length, so the lower body mold may indeed be different on US cars  Email is on the way

 

Jenna

[TAR]

In the picture above, part of the heatshield is missing. It sits in front of the exhauset (as you are looking at it in the picture). Its made of ferrobestos. It's item 10 in the image below

[Jenna'sEspritTurbo]

So the wheel well body configuration is indeed different afterall This explains why I am 2.5 inches short on the pipe. The Federal cars look nothing like that. You can see where i cut the forward portion out

Edited February 10, 2017 by Jenna'sEspritTurbo

[Jenna'sEspritTurbo]

I got a email from Leon at Alunox today. They have agreed to help me finishing the exhaust by sending me what I need. The problem appears to be that the G car Federal bodies are indeed different in the wheel well and they did not know that building the system so it appears. They built their exhaust system after the the headers around the UK/ROW cars I will supply them everything it took spec wise to make the system work on Federal cars along with pictures to help guide them. This will insure that future systems will work perfectly once they ship them here for Federal G cars. We do need to have a good relationship with this company into the future so they can supply the right quality system  for all Lotus owners into the future generations. This fix could not have been done without Mark Kassim in the UK and Jon Slocum's help and some good ole I can do this myself engineering. Thank you Leon for stepping up.

[Jenna'sEspritTurbo]

On 2/10/2017 at 15:23, TAR said:

I have attached a couple pictures that were sent to Alunox to add to their Federal G car exhaust pipe. This applies only to a car that is OEM factory standard issue on a new car. Basically I added 2.25 inches or 60 mm to the pipe they shipped me. Adding a piece that is 2.5 inches would not be a bad idea either. I added this past the waste gate return in the radius that was cut to use a straight piece of pipe to extend the pipe. This allowed me about 1 inch behind the pipe to the inner fender well and room to wrap the pipe with a heat shielding material. I asked Alunox to add this to their files for future reference. I would consult with them that it is now part of a G-car, Federal edition before buying the entire exhaust system. The pipe in the car picture is hanging down a bit in this picture because there are no nuts on the turbo yet and it was a loose fit to check for fit up. When held tight it looks great. I will add heat shield wrap the entire length. The new turbo gasket will be here tomorrow and I will attempt to fit up the rest and check for battery box interference. I did have to cut about 3 inches of the wheel well out forward of the exhaust pipe to get the wastegate return through. It is a thin fiberglass area and nothing structurally was affected. The wastegate also required two 90 degree 4an X 1/16 fittings to get the pressure line away from the header tubes. With a straight on there was no way to get the pressure line on as it is up against the pipe. Those are coming with the gasket also. Treadstone Performance in Miami Florida is the only US supplier that supplies the 1/16 size 90 degree elbows. Big thank you to the member that supplied the information.

 

[Robert Weber]

Having just bought my 1994 S4, is it too late to participate in the group buy?

Also curious about shipping charges/duties for a USA buyer?

thank you,

Bob

[silverfrost]

Glad to hear it is getting sorted Jenna     Bob sadly the group purchase has ended, but you can contact the maker and see what price they can do one for , at least they will have the jigs made already for production, which should cut a little of the cost for you to purchase maybe ?

 

 

 

[gfallon]

I had a fitment issue with mine also. its a different problem from the others.

the turbo placement in incorrect with mine it may also be at the wrong angle. you can see I had to have a  .75 inch spacer made so the "turbo" tube would bolt up to the plenum. I already had a nice ss exhaust that the previous owner put on back in the 80's but with the turbo placement being off it was very difficult to get everything to fit correctly, but I was able to get it all to fit so I am happy with it.

only thing is I misplaced my nice turbo support plate so I made one that bolts up to the trans and used the link that was supplied. I would like to find out if I can get another one that way it will be supported on both sides of the turbo   

[MrDangerUS]

Any more observations/tips on Alunox installation? 

Pages 14 and 15 are really interesting. IMO, worth continuing..

Thank you Mark Kassim for being a driving force behind this GREAT modification initiative!

John

[MrDangerUS]

On 17/11/2016 at 18:00, Jacques said:

I too, ground Down a ring spanner. Some I took off from below, sitting either facing rear end of car, or front end of car, to get my arms at a good angle. A few I took off from above. And took the engine mount heat protection off as well. Took long time, but was easy enough. Bibs mentioned my writing on my Stevens car in the above.

Thing is, don't expect to spin a nut a lot at a time. I could sometimes only do 1/16'th or 1/8'th of a turn, before taking spann off, and reposition. Some you'll be easier off looking at first, then move yourself into position and do the nuts in blindness. Easier really. Some are visible and easy to undo. All the nuts on my car came off easy, and with that in mind, you can save some hours of grief, and I can say it will take 2-3 hours first time, maybe 4. Now? 1 hour job. I was sitting on a small chair in a pit under the Esprit.

Note: I now use the super splendid K-Nuts in the high grade version. Smaller, lighter and does not fall off or loosen. And you can use a smaller ring spanner (11mm I think I used), plus a small 1/4" socket set.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

Here are some of the tools I have used to tighten K-nuts (10mm heads) on the gen 3  (CNC flanges) header.  Most useful were ratcheting ring spanners, "ratchet-less" stubby ratchet handle and wobbly extensions.  Most difficult were 4 top nuts in the milled "pockets" (real PITA!). They have to driven first and incrementally moving back and forth trough all cylinders.