Lotus future in the UK

[TBD]

Genii story picked up by the BBC today.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...orfolk-17714223

So, would anyone be surprised

[Lowtus]

They do indeed get themselves into some fine muddles. It's hard to believe it's nearly a decade since I put down a deposit at the dealer for a long-awaited "new Esprit". I gave up and recovered my deposit a couple of years later.

I did my best to get excited about Evora but no, just no.

Now I have my fingers tightly crossed that Exige V6 convertible will see the light of day.....

[alan]

Plans for £10.4m of government funding for sports car maker Group Lotus have been put on hold while its new owner makes a decision on its future - http://www.bbc.co.uk...orfolk-17720535

PS Just got back from 3 weeks holiday. Seems a lot has been happening whilst I was away

[Iconic Ride]

One can only hope that the withholding decision by the RDA is a "carrot dangle" action to persuade DRB-Hicom to remain in Norfolk, rather than a financial "abandon ship" money conservation election alone.

And, Alan, could you see your way fit to go on another holiday? It seems to move things along more rapidly, the standard "correlation vs causal effects" debate notwithstanding.

[Kimbers]

The issue is more about them being worried that if they put the £10 mill into Lotus and then DRB decide to clear the decks (so to speak) that it will be lost money. It's designed to generate employment and develop Manufacturing/local business, not pay off debts.

You can understand why they are holding it back.

About time DRB pulled their finger out though. Being in limbo isn't helping anyone.

[Bibs]

Just to confirm, Dany Bahar is at work today on site in Hethel.

[Bee]

Bit of news from Dany ...

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/281842/latest_on_the_future_of_lotus.html

[Kimbers]

Good to see the 2 choices are Invest or sell. Not close.

[Bibs]

I don't think close was ever on DRB's agenda? I'm sure the administration rumours were from Joe Sawards blog and even if they were true, Lotus would have done a 'phoenix' reformation I'd have thought?

[Gus82]

_{"Now, in a further twist, the EDP has learned that Group Lotus boss Dany Bahar was instrumental with another director, Azman Bin Abdullah, in registering a new joint venture, Lotus Youngman, at Companies House on January 13, three days before the sale of Proton was announced."}

_{The MP also questioned the latest Lotus Youngman venture.}

“I suspect there is more to this than meets the eye,” he said. “If it’s genuinely nothing to worry about, then the company should go on the front foot and say very clearly why this is the case. Lotus Youngman was incorporated in January 2012, so this raises serious questions as to why the Malaysian stock exchange wasn’t informed until last Thursday.”

_{http://www.edp24.co....otus_1_1350788}

_{I don't know what to think about this, seems very odd and all a bit shadey really. I'm increasingly hoping that Mr Bahar leaves and Genii take over the business.}

Edited April 17, 2012 by Gus82

[mdavies]

Isn’t it likely there is a some neutral or plausibly innocent explanation for “Lotus Youngman”?

As Youngman is the importer/distributor for Lotus and, as reported, has set up a joint R&D centre, there could be good reasons for some form of incorporated body to host a joint enterprise. As to timing, perhaps in January the situation was full speed ahead, but was suddenly brought to a halt by the DRB-Hicom move. I can imagine that tieing up an administrative loose end with the Malaysian stock exchange regarding a future venture that was now frozen was not top of the minds of the people involved.

Again, if no innocent purpose can be shown, setting up the L Y company in DBs position, if for an envisaged potential gain by a minority group in the face of the major organisations and even national interests involved would seem to be such a high risk venture that it could not be entertained.

Who knows? But to assume the worst seems implausible to me.

Edited April 17, 2012 by mdavies

[Gus82]

Car interview with Bahar yesterday:

http://www.carmagazi...siness---Bahar/

I'm a little more confident after reading that (though the previous article I posted still raises questions...)

Glad to see they are rethinking the model range planned. Yes, they need a few cars not just a single model. However they also need to use money generated by those models to both re-develop them, keeping sales high and pay down the debts. I doubt we will see the new Elise the margin in cars at that price range aren't high enough for the investment, so a more focussed track day car or cheap updates to the current car is more likely.

I would imagine a range of either Esprit plus Elite and possibly Eterne, or Esprit plus another mid-engined model above or below that car.

I also wonder if Mr Bahar's tour of countries with cash rich individuals and investment funds is of significance.....

Edited April 17, 2012 by Gus82

[jimw]

I have set up a Facebook page mainly to publish links from the EDP coverage of Hethels future. You can find the page at http://www.facebook.com/pages/Keep-Lotus-in-the-UK/427145457300106

All the best Jim ( Excel still languishing in the garage!)

[hedgerley]

I'm wondering what the two surprises are for Goodwood.

[Kimbers]

I also wonder if Mr Bahar's tour of countries with cash rich individuals and investment funds is of significance.....

Not really seeing as how he's with the head of Youngman. Not a good time to be seen together, I think DB needs to distance himself from any association that can be called into question while everything is going on.

It would be illegal in the UK to do this without informing the stock exchange (in a public quoted company) is it different in Malaysia?

[Bee]

Full Car interview with Dany Bahar ...

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/News/Search-Results/Industry-News/CAR-interviews-Dany-Bahar-Lotus-CEO-on-those-rumours-2012/?content-block=0

If I see the new Esprit at Goodwood, I actually might start realistically saving for an Elite!!!

P.S. Who renamed my topic?

[Bibs]

Ben, that link is posted above in post 93 mate. Your topic would have been merged with this one on the same subject by one of the moderators, it makes sense to keep the same discussions together

Be nice to see the new Esprit with the new engine in situ at Goodwood, are you going?

[hedgerley]

Here's a thought - aren't Lotus helping Infiniti to build a couple of working Emerge-e prototypes? At Geneva there was much debate about whether it would go into limited production and who would be build it. Infiniti did admit to preliminary discussions with Lotus about a deal that would be similar to Tesla's. I would expect the current hiatus to have put the dampner on those discussions though.

Anyhow, if we see an Emerge-e belting up the hill at Goodwood, you heard it here first.

[hedgerley]

And here's an explanation about the Youngman connection.

http://skiddmark.com/2012/04/lotus-speaks-out-about-its-relationship-with-chinas-youngman/

So that's that cleared up then!

[mdavies]

Part of Lotus' response as extract from the skiddmark.com article posted by hedgerley:

The formation of this company was to facilitate a proposed joint venture between Lotus and Youngman for the development of certain automotive products. The discussions have been ongoing for more than 18 months. The name of the joint venture company was agreed between the parties and the company was incorporated to protect that name. Youngman has existing commercial relationships with both Proton and Lotus and the formation of the company relates solely to the joint venture and nothing more. If the proposed joint venture does not proceed, the company will become dormant.

Given the potential seriousness of the issues involved in the current Lotus scenario, I want to make clear that my post number 92 above was made without any advance knowledge and that I have no connection with any of the parties or bodies involved.

Edited April 18, 2012 by mdavies

[jimw]

More in the EDP today

http://www.edp24.co.uk/business/group_lotus_boss_dany_bahar_says_moving_the_company_out_of_norfolk_makes_no_sense_1_1351978

updated on http://www.facebook.com/pages/Keep-Lotus-in-the-UK/427145457300106

[jimw]

The full interview from todays EDP http://www.edp24.co.uk/business/full_interview_group_lotus_boss_dany_bahar_says_moving_the_company_out_of_norfolk_makes_no_sense_1_1352203

[Bibs]

Cameron steams in

[jonwat]

Watched this on PMQs today & thought "that'll be the end of them then"

[MHC]

Any comparison between Lotus and McLaren is pointless, McLaren had the time and money to build a supercar better than the competition, Lotus never did in the history of the company, which is why they never developed a gear box at supercar level.

IMHO the Elan SE was the best finished car Lotus ever built for it's market.

Any input from wannaby car designers and engineers is largely pointless. If the experts cant get it right then there is probably a reason for this, that stops any wannaby designers getting it right too; time and money, hopefully that has changed.

I agree with you re. the M100 Elan, mine is 20 years old this year and still going strong, but if I remember rightly Lotus spent so much getting it right they went bankrupt in the process. Didn't help of course that they launched it right at the start of a recession. The parallels with the Evora today are alarmingly clear .....

The 35 refers to cars registered in the UK in the first three months of the year. This includes sales, dealer registrations and factory registrations.

It does not include cars sold/shipped outside the UK or cars manufactured for the UK market but not registered.

Quite. We might think of Lotus as British, but the reality is that the future for Lotus (and others) is in the US and eventually China markets. UK sales are almost irrelevant in comparison.