Window Voltage Module

[sailorbob]

Does anyone have a logic diagram for the window voltage module (part no. B082M6531F)? Trying to do a bit a fault finding and see how this thing works in the great scheme of things.

[doct93]

Sorry to bump an old topic - I'm having a problem with my GT3 windows not working.

I suspect the window voltage module, but these are no longer available.

Apparently the USA cars had a bypass plug instead?

Does anyone either:

a) have a spare module I could buy off them?

Or b) know which pins the bridging / bypass plug connects together?

Otherwise it's c) rewire the whole thing with some different relays....

Thanks in advance,

Tim

[sailorbob]

The wiring (and window motors) on the USA specification cars with the bridging link is quite different to the cars with the window voltage module.

 

I am not sure that you can bridge out anything on the window voltage module as I suspect its output is less than 12 volts.

[doct93]

Could be option d) replace all the components on the PCB then.....!

Tim

[fjmuurling]

or option e) resolder the old components (remove old solder, clean and solder again)

[doct93]

Good plan!

[doct93]

Quick update to anyone with the same problem - have restored power to windows by bridging the switched (from ignition) live pin to the brown/white output pin that goes to the window switches. Both windows still power through the appropriate fuses and now the switches don't light unless the ignition is on.

Resoldering the module not successful, am wondering what exactly it does and why I would need it? Am a little concerned as to why it would need a 40v capacitor.....

Tim B

[swindon_alan]

On 08/08/2014 at 21:51, sailorbob said:

The wiring (and window motors) on the USA specification cars with the bridging link is quite different to the cars with the window voltage module.

I am not sure that you can bridge out anything on the window voltage module as I suspect its output is less than 12 volts.

There is no difference between US and RoW models on wiring or motors. US cars don't have the window delay module fitted and the US bridging link is a simple pin 5 to pin 8 short, as detailed in the previous post. This works for RoW cars with knackered window voltage modules too.

More to follow soon.

 

[ramjet]

I can remember trying to fault find an issue on my windows and not being able to figure out what that module was fro either.

I just live with the issues my windows have now. They both work so all is good. I don't think they will stop for a trapped hand though. Maybe the current draw feedback for that is handled by that module?

[swindon_alan]

The module is really rather silly to be honest. I will post a shedload more later this week as I have done a thorough investigation of all the Esprit relay modules down to component level as four of the buggers appear to be totally custom and Lotus only. I have designed and tested workarounds for all of them now

Functional description of the "window logic module":

The windows are operative under any of the following conditions:

(Non-USA cars - which having the "bridging link");
- Whenever the ignition is switched on;
- During the period between switching off the ignition and a door being opened and closed;
- When either door is open;.
- When the transmitter key is used to arm the vehicle alarm, both door windows will automatically close (unless the intrusion sensing has been switched off).
- When using the mechanical key to lock the car, if the key is turned and held at the locking position for a moment, both door windows will close automatically.

So all it does is to check the state of the ignition and apply a policy. Pretty over-engineered, but then this is Lotus...

It has nothing to do with the "trapped hand" angle though, that's a function of the lift motor

 

[ramjet]

Thanks for that Alan. My motor modules must be awry then as I can not seem to get the windows to stop no matter what I try.

[Barrykearley]

@swindon_alan So mine should have a total closure system then - I shall try that out

[sailorbob]

6 hours ago, swindon_alan said:

There is no difference between US and RoW models on wiring or motors.

6 hours ago, swindon_alan said:

It has nothing to do with the "trapped hand" angle though, that's a function of the lift motor

So, you are agreeing there is a difference between the motors.........

[swindon_alan]

12 hours ago, sailorbob said:

So, you are agreeing there is a difference between the motors.........

Hello Derek. I've had another look at this, it was getting rather late last night. Apologies, yes - the US and non-US motors and wiring are different:

 

 

What I was alluding to was that the bridging link used on US cars is effectively the workaround for a duff non-US window logic module, i.e. shorting pins 5 and 8 on the relay socket. Then you are in US mode in that the windows will only work when the ignition is on (the link feeds the window lift switches from the switched ignition). However, both types use the same voltage, 12V.

Moving on, @ramjet:

The non-US obstruction sensing is a function of the non-US lift motors (it is in the motor electronics, nothing to do with the logic module). If yours do not have this capability then there are a few things to check and try. Presumably your S4 is fitted with the window logic module, indicating it has non-US lift motors. If so then you should have the sensing override button in the centre console pocket? Does your "one touch" operation work?

I found this in the manual:

Obstruction Sensing: On non-USA cars, a safety feature is incorporated into the window closing mechanism, such that if an obstruction is sensed (increased resistance) during the last third of the travel, the motor stops automatically and reverses window glass movement for a moment. This feature may be manually overridden to cope with frosty conditions and the stiffer window action which may result. An override button is provided in the tunnel top switch panel, and must be pressed together with the window switch. If difficulty is experienced in lowering or raising a window in extremely cold conditions, use a windscreen de-icer spray along the door to glass seal. Do NOT use radiator anti-freeze solutions, as these could seriously damage the paintwork.

WARNING: On non-USA cars, if the battery becomes discharged or the power supply interrupted (e.g. battery disconnected), the window system must be re-programmed after power reinstatement or neither the obstruction sensing or ‘one touch’ features will operate. To re-programme each window: Lower the window fully and keep the switch pressed for 5 to 10 seconds until a ‘click’ is heard. Then raise the window fully and keep the switch pressed until a ‘click’ is heard. Repeat the procedure for the opposite window.

[sailorbob]

Are you sure the voltage output on pin 8 of the window voltage module is 12 volts? I ask because this output is fed into the transistor module of the window motor and does not drive the motor directly.

[swindon_alan]

Pretty much. There's a 220 Ohm resistor between the 12V positive post and the motor output, also used to drop the supply voltage to the CD4013B flip flop in the module as well, then it's not much less than rail. Probably some guaranteed bias on the base of the motor transistors as well.

I have strapped the switch power to ignition 12V and the motors work fine, also as per the previous posts.

[swindon_alan]

NB on the US models, pin 8 outputs to relays that drive the window lifts, so even in that case they are not power feeds. Transistors or relays, similar use case.

[sailorbob]

The 220 ohm resistor is in the gnd line not the +12 volt line. It's a ballast resistor to limit the current through the LED of the window switch.

Edited April 25, 2016 by sailorbob

[ramjet]

2 hours ago, swindon_alan said:

Moving on, @ramjet:

The non-US obstruction sensing is a function of the non-US lift motors (it is in the motor electronics, nothing to do with the logic module). If yours do not have this capability then there are a few things to check and try. Presumably your S4 is fitted with the window logic module, indicating it has non-US lift motors. If so then you should have the sensing override button in the centre console pocket? Does your "one touch" operation work?

 

My one-touch operation only works on one window. The other window does not recognise it. The windows will also not raise to a closed position using the key in the lock and holding the key in the locked position. I tested and tested and could not get them to work correctly. I just live with it now. Getting new window motor modules seems harder that I thought even though the company still exists in Germany (I think). Emails went unanswered though they still are on the web.

I started a topic in the 'glass' section of the Stevens area.

[swindon_alan]

18 minutes ago, sailorbob said:

The 220 ohm resistor is in the gnd line not the +12 volt line.

I was referring to the 220 Ohm resistor inside the module between pins 6 and 2 and the pin 8 transistor output. Try taking one apart Derek.

[sailorbob]

Ah, because you said positive post I though you were mistaking the -ve post that's commoned at pin 4 of the window logic module with the window switches gnd line on the V8's and spliced with with the window switches gnd line on the 4 cylinder cars.