Low gear Reduction Starter Motor

[ActiLotus]

Hi Guys,

 

I have removed and installed a new starter motor.

 

I have 3 wires dangling at the moment

 

A brown wire coming from the alternator

2 red wires coming from the battery looks like

 

a Square shaped connector which is pretty obvious goes into its slot.

 

My question is all 3 wires above were connected on the lucas starter motor at the back with a bolt screw.

 

Now the new hi torque starter does not have those connections in the back it has:

 

A side bolt which is covered with a black plastic cover

A bolt at the rear under starter

 

Thats it

 

where do my 3 wires connect?

 

Thanks

The original Lucas starter had 2 bolts on the back and and top bolt held all 3 wires together when I disassmebled it today

The new one does not have bolts to connect on the rear like the lucas.. It is correct though

 

Helpppppppppp!

Anyone going to help?

[philip600]

Hi, not 100% sure but normally starter motors only have big thick cable direct from battery ( there may be two joined ) & a small connector to the solenoid, that's all it shows in wiring diagrams ? Could some of the wires just have been piggy backed to each other. Don't attempt to connect these until you have confirmed what the wires are !!

I'll try & have a look at mine tomorrow but a multi-meter may be useful.

Sorry, meant to check which model Esprit you have ?

Phil.

[slewthy]

OK, just done this job.

 

Hopefully you have got yours working but...

 

Thick red wires from battery AND the thick brown one from the alternator go together and should be bolted to the screw terminal on the starter (underneath it). Not too tight there!

You now have one or probably two wires left. These should be spade connectors with covers. Just one of these should fit into the black connector on the starter body. The other is not needed and can be taped off.

Hopefully you have a wiring diagram for your car but on MINE, which is an S3, 1986 NA, the one to connect is the red/white one. Yours may well be different! BUT, this is the switching wire and is only live when the ignition is fully on.

 

Let us know how you get on!

[Freemason]

I'm going to get a high-torque starter motor for my 1978 Esprit S2.

 

Should I go for this:

 

http://classiccarperformance.com/store/products_detail.php?ProductID=33

 

Which I believe is the same as this one on ebay:

 

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Gear-Reduction-Starter-Motor-LOTUS-Esprit-Jensen-Healey-/230620025065?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35b20650e9&_uhb=1

 

Or should I get this one from the UK?

 

http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk/product/837

Edited October 1, 2013 by Freemason

[Paul93Lotus]

Let us know what it sounds like turning over.  There was an Esprit on Youtube (a G-Car) that must have had a replacement starter and it sounded far superior (more of a motorsport sound) than the original.  Also let us know if it frees up some space underneath the plenum.

[slewthy]

Here is a link to my youtube vid (just uploaded) of my upgrade. Its somewhere else on here but, here you go.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfN6qCUnXGA&feature=youtu.be

[mdw]

Now that's quite impressive!! Not only the better cranking but the extra space as well.

Edited October 3, 2013 by mdw

[Paul93Lotus]

That sounds awesome...sort of similar to what the starter sounds like from a McLaren F1 with the whirr after ignition.  That alone is worth the upgrade...makes it sound like you're starting something special under the bonnet/boot (you are but the stock unit does not do it justice).  Not exactly the same, but close as you can probably get:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3JaCjGnPBU

 

That is my next upgrade.  Probably uses a lot less amps at start up as well.  Simon...where did you purchase yours?

Edited October 4, 2013 by Paul93Lotus

[slewthy]

AES - auto electric supplies  http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk/

Price not much different to elsewhere but free postage and fast too.

[Qavion]

_{I'm just about to fit a gear reduction starter motor from classicsportscars.com to my 89 SE.}

 

_{http://classiccarperformance.com/store/products_detail.php?ProductID=33}

 

_{Despite claiming to be half the weight of the old starter, it doesn't appear to be any much smaller than the old one. The solenoid is monstrous. I'm just wondering if anyone has fitted this type and if so, at what position did you put the solenoid? If I put it on top like the old one, I don't think the coolant pipes and wiring in the engine bay would fit around it. If I put it at 45 degrees downwards and away from the engine, it takes up more space in the engine compartment and the large electrical connector would be difficult to get to.}

 

_{The picture essentially shows how I would probably have to fit it, although the mounting plate would be positioned differently. The ideal position, unfortunately, cannot be achieved as the positioning of the solenoid prevents access to the mounting nuts.}

 

_{The road to ruin is paved with good intentions....}

 

_{Thanks for any insight.}

 

_Cheers

_Ian.

 

[Qavion]

Please disregard. I put it in the too hard basket and put the old starter back in. Simply don't believe all the claims of perfect compatibility. It certainly won't fit on my SE without lots of problems.

 

ALSO....  Some retailers are claiming that the high torque starter motors are half the weight of the original motors. What a load of cobblers. The old starter/solenoid assembly weighs approx 5 kg. The new one weighs around 4 kg.

 

The starter itself may be half the weight, but the solenoid is much larger.

 

The claimed savings in weight was one of the biggest incentives (for me) for buying the new starter.

Caveat emptor

 

Cheers

Ian.

[mdw]

A few of us have them fitted.  Yes they weigh almost as much as the old one but you do get a lot more space between the oil filter and the starter  and for  me the main reason was it starts easily not with a asthmatic crank on a cold or luke warm morning.

[Qavion]

Thanks, Malcolm.

I'm not sure how you're getting that much extra clearance between the starter motor and the oil filter. I measured both items and there was only half an inch difference on my SE. The extra size of the solenoid would have also restricted access to the oil pressure sender on the engine block.

 

I also found aluminium casting flaws on the new starter. I thought about returning the item, but it would have cost too much to send it back to the USA (from Australia).

 

There is an alternative item available in Australia from Lotus Marques which I wasn't aware of earlier. it looks like it has a better design in some respects, but it's a little more expensive.

 

http://www.lotusmarques.com/parts/datasheets/89-lotus-esprit-high-torque-stater-motor.

 

Cheers

Ian

[Freemason]

That Australian one looks interesting, but no mention in the article of price or how to buy? And I can't find it in the products section.

[mdw]

http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk/product/837/category/139

 

is the one I have fitted.

 

 

[sailorbob]

The Powerlite starter motor (it uses a Denso motor I believe) that Malcolm refers to is the one most people fit and it's a straight bolt on replacement that improve clearance quite a bit. There is an issue with it though, the drain holes are in the wrong place when used on the Renault gearbox and these need repositioning.

[semi42]

i just refurbed my starter, new brushes and solenoid, and powder coated

[Freemason]

I contacted Lotus Marques about their starter motor for my S2 and got this response:

 

We have just upgraded the high torque starter that suits your Esprit
The starter now comprises of stronger CNC alloy billet vernier adapter and gearbox casing
Originally these both these components were castings
The motor has also been upgraded from 1KW to 1.2KW
The original starter motor data sheet can be seen here
http://www.lotusmarques.com/parts/datasheets/89-lotus-esprit-high-torque-stater-motor
I will have a new set of photos for the latest specification starter motor tomorrow
The new starter motor is priced at AUS $350-00
Kind regards, Steve

 

 

What do people reckon? Would this one be worth the extra cash? Is the Lotus Marques starter superior to this one?

 

http://classiccarperformance.com/store/products_detail.php?ProductID=33

Edited November 28, 2013 by Freemason

[Qavion]

I don't think you could really say without pulling both starters to pieces and doing electrical analyses. However, the alloy billet vernier adaptor and gearbox casing certainly sound better than the one I bought, and as the Lotus Marques' specs say, it has additional dowels to cope with the torque.

 

Does the S2 (high current) wiring come from the right side of the engine bay? If the starter was mounted at the angle shown in the photo, will the wiring clear the small connector? (and will the starter clear the dipstick tube in that position?)

 

Both claim significant "starter" weight savings. This may be true, but as a unit (starter and solenoid), there is only a kilogram of saving at most.

 

If you're desperate for a new starter, I have the cheaper one going in the recycling bin soon I guess if I needed one in the future, I'd be buying the Lotus Marques version. Steve has been very generous with his time solving some of my problems, so I usually give him my custom (I just didn't know he had his own version of the starter).

 

Cheers

Ian.

 

P.S. Did the A$350 include postage and GST?