Brexit

[C8RKH]

1 hour ago, oilmagnet477 said:

Inserted or ingested? Confused of Norfolk 😘

If you ingest enough I often find something gets inserted eventually!   Equally confused, but of Scotland, but, that's only because I've been doing a load of thinking. Which hurts my head more than ingesting lubrication does.

 

3 years ago we all had the chance, as the people of the UK to have a vote on whether we go or stay.

The biggest turnout of people in the history of votes for the people decided we should go.

Ah ha, 2 years later we hear "but no, what we really need is a people's vote".

Because the biggest turn out of people, ever, did not in reality mean that the people had had a chance to have their say and have a vote.

How can this be.

Well, there are 65m people in the UK.  46.5m were eligible to vote, but only 33.5m could be arsed to vote! But hey, that's still a 72% turnout of the people who are eligible. And of that number over 17m voted to go. But that wasn't a people's vote? No? Really?

At this point, my head hurts as I would like to say to Mr. Cable and his ilk - well and truly get to fook you useless doddering morons for suggesting we need a "people's vote" given the above.

But then my head hurts more as I'd like to say to Mr. Corbyn and his ilk - when are you actually going to take that fence from out of your backside and actually find the principles that you obviously lost in a haystack and do the right thing for this country and her people, as opposed to your own selfish good.

Now, I must have ingested a lot as my head is really hurting now. As I would not like to say anything to Mogg and the his ERG cronies. I would just like to wave them off as they set sail on a small boat, safe in the knowledge that I had pulled the plug out of the bottom of the hull.

Buy hey. it will all be good. Cause Brexit means Brexit. Which actually means we will never agree on anything. We'll spend 3 years shouting at each other. We'll spend hundreds, neh, billions of pounds on not being prepared. And we'll act all surprised and cry out for more time when the deadline finally arrives, as well, it wasn't really a deadline was it. More a speck on the horizon. A bit like that speck on the horizon that became an iceberg that took out the unsinkable ship.

Oh well. Must be time for a people's vote. For the people who had their say but lost to have another chance to have their say and lose again. Wow, but hey, maybe they win. But the turnout will be less than the previous record breaking 72%. So we will cry - injustice! This cannae be right. There are 65m people in the Uk and only 30 something million of them voted so it was not a people's vote. The people need a vote to choose the right path.

Roll forward to 2047. I'm 80. My head's stopped hurting, even though we are on people's vote number 28. But that's because I'm now dead, and thankfully, I no longer need to worry anymore about a people's vote or that Brexit pish.

 

[Advantage]

I have a Twitter account. I don't follow many other Twitterers on there, mainly people, a few ski resorts and some motoring stuff - but a couple of the larger news agencies too. A while ago I used the site's inbuilt censoring system to mute and/or block posts that contain the B-word. I can't begin to explain how much more pleasant the user experience is now.   

[C8RKH]

12 minutes ago, Advantage said:

I have a Twitter account. I don't follow many other Twitterers on there, mainly people, a few ski resorts and some motoring stuff - but a couple of the larger news agencies too. A while ago I used the site's inbuilt censoring system to mute and/or block posts that contain the B-word. I can't begin to explain how much more pleasant the user experience is now.   

I'm sure @Bibs would be only too willing to show you how to unfollow threads on here too! 

[Advantage]

You misunderstand the point I was making. On here and another site the debate is reasoned, calm and informed. On Twitter it's OHMYGODTHESKYISFALLINGDOWNWEREALLDOOMEDNASTYEVILTORIESAREALLRACISTS over and over again. Hence the reason for avoiding such nonsense on that platform. 

[march]

The people of the South West are now mobilising for these long threatened protests - well 1 is! 😂. Is Barry on holiday in Cornwall at the moment?

 

[PaulCP]

I see Macron is trying to flex his very weak muscles 

Well, they must be very weak since he hasn’t got the backbone to sort out his own country’s problems and tries to seeks solitude by creating diversions whilst hoping to flash his manhood at Merkel

[JG220]

I still think there is a less than 1% chance of a no-deal/Hard (call it what you want) Brexit next week. 

It's everything thereafter we need to worry about (on both sides of the debate). 

[Barrykearley]

There is a very real prospect that we will actually leave on the 29th. Macron has already stated he will veto an extension - so maybe he has finally got something right - since let’s face it if you watch the bbc everything is peachy in Paris.

May is playing a blinder at ensuring she pisses absolutely everyone off and the MV3 just gets canned.

hence - by default out we go into the wilderness.

 

 

 

paradise here we come 👍

[PaulCP]

Nah, Macron just does as he is told to do by Merkel.

No backbone, he just likes shooting his mouth off to try to convince others  that he’s a somebody. This was the point behind my “weak muscles”  post above.

The EU are still trying to engineer the Brexit process towards a further referendum by hoping that Parliament will still vote May’s deal down and then vote for a long extension rather than no deal exit. The EU will then stipulate that a long extension will be conditional on a new referendum.

The EU are now firmly in the driving seat!

[Andyww]

20 minutes ago, PaulCP said:

The EU are still trying to engineer the Brexit process towards a further referendum

Exactly.

I cant understand why people are even considering we will leave with no deal. It is just never going to happen because the people who actually control things on both sides dont want it. The wishes of the people long since became irrelevant since the Gina Miller intervention.

The powers that be will engineer a second vote which will result in remaining. I disagree with Corbyn on almost everything but one thing I do admire him for is he has made a stand against these people, but he will eventually buckle.

[Neal H]

I completely agree with @PaulCP and @Andyww MP's will vote down May's deal again next week (assuming they can even get it to vote stage) and the EU will then grant a long extention on proviso the UK holds a second referendum. Remaining has always been the goal of the politians in both the EU and UK. Their only problem will then be if the UK votes leave again, but given the sustained anti-Brexit assault from the establishment and media over the past three years, they have good reason to think that won't happen again.

[Kimbers]

41 minutes ago, Neal H said:

Remaining has always been the goal of the politians in both the EU and UK. Their only problem will then be if the UK votes leave again, but given the sustained anti-Brexit assault from the establishment and media over the past three years, they have good reason to think that won't happen again.

Agree 100% except all the polls are showing it yet again too tight to get a fag paper between. I wouldn't support another vote and have already sent emails to my local MP, but would love for them to have another and lose by an even bigger margin!! I for one will vote leave again and if they get a minor result to remain then will be demanding another vote and will Vote UKIP until I get what I want despite them being a one trick Pony. I genuinely think that will be the only way to get a real Exit from the EU. However the Govt know they will be facing civil unrest should they suddenly remain and I know many people who will take to the streets. 

[pete]

Bookmakers offering 20/1 no deal

[JG220]

It was at 4/1 last night before the EU came to the rescue. 

Actually you can still get 11/4 at the moment on no deal. 

You can also get 5/2 on Art50 being revoked. 

[pete]

Think 20/1 on Betfair is a better deal😎

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

Theresa May might fancy a bit of that to put towards her retirement. Sod the rest of us.

[pete]

The bank of Spain has warned that the new government after the forthcoming general election should expect an economic downturn due to certain events such as brexit

[Barrykearley]

10 hours ago, Neal H said:

I completely agree with @PaulCP and @Andyww MP's will vote down May's deal again next week (assuming they can even get it to vote stage) and the EU will then grant a long extention on proviso the UK holds a second referendum. Remaining has always been the goal of the politians in both the EU and UK. Their only problem will then be if the UK votes leave again, but given the sustained anti-Brexit assault from the establishment and media over the past three years, they have good reason to think that won't happen again.

If there was the possibility of a remain vote - rest assured we would already have had it.

my gut feel is the outcome will be just the same - possibly a bigger leave margin - since many remain voters actually respect the democratic process and have also seen the reprehensible behaviour of the eu over the last few years

[JG220]

I don’t think we know that. 

One tging is clear though I think a leave campaign would be hard to beat given that they woul mobilise fast and have a very clear message which will resonate (however wrong I think it would be)

by by the way the EU has been perfectly proper in the negotiations (apart from the silly dance) . The UK on the other hand has been a sham.

Edited March 22, 2019 by JG220

[Barrykearley]

Proper? Have you seen Mr Junker ? He’s like Norman Wisdom who’s been on the sherry all day

[Andyww]

All the people I know who voted leave would do so again but there are many people who have no strong views on the EU, or anything else for that matter, and will believe all the crap being spouted about people dying owing to medicine shortages etc. 

Furthermore in the first referendum probably almost all leavers actually voted but a far lower percentage of remainers voted. They will all be out there next time, especially younger people who are also being leaned-on by the universities and other bodies which heavily benefit from remaining.

I would guess if held now, it would be 60% remain unfortunately. Then the other issue is they might try to split the leave vote by offering 2 leave options. It would be contemptible if they did that but wouldnt put it past them.

 

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

Also remember that it was the older generation which voted predominantly for Leave and the younger generation that voted predominantly to Remain. 3 years on and 1.5 million UK citizens have since died, mainly from the older group. Secondly 2 million extra youngsters would now be eligible to vote in any potential second referendum. Even if none of the original voters changed their minds, the result of a second vote today would most likely now be heading in Remain’s favour.

[Barrykearley]

Oh the young - forgot them - they all of course have been brainwashed by the media.

however - it really doesn’t take long to find huge swathes of young people whom can see the subversion of our democracy and will be voting leave! 

Dont believe the media bias

[C8RKH]

So what the last 3 or 4 posts are essentially saying is that the 3 years of stalling and procrastination have actually, or most possibly, been enough to scupper the democratic outcome at the time.  Just wow.

I am starting to ponder, in a jokey manner as I do, that @JG220 is possibly the offspring of a late afternoon, post lunch, collaboration between a certain Mr. Junckers and Ms. Merkel!  But then I did cuss myself for having such stupid and obviously incorrect ponders as he drives a Lotus, and not a German car.

[march]

I really do not understand this argument that X amount of people have died since the decision was mad and X amount of new people have entered the voting population as a justification of a new vote. At what point does this become valid and under what criteria. If people want to use this argument they need to be able to justify it in a quantifiable and provable manner and it needs to be implemented for all UK laws and rulings - after all we need to be fair and even handed. Please can anyone who believes in this argument justify this in any meaningful way - I bet you can't. And of course this will need to keep repeating.

We seem to be in an era where collective decision making is only allowed when it aligns itself with the individual, which is impossible.

As a note I suspect that peoples view changes with age (mine certainly has), younger people tend to be more left wing in their youth and as they grow older they mellow become and finally become more right wing (generalisation I know). So grumpy old farts popping their clogs tend to be replaced with others who become grumpy old farts. Looking at the demographic of this web site perhaps the members of this website could be used as a case study 😜. So the above argument may not be as helpful for the remain outcome as some may think.

 

Oh - and another whinge, how can someone come onto a news channel and say that Ireland voted to remain, Scotland and Wales voted to remain and if you look the rest as a whole they voted to remain. So we should remain if we are being fair. And they gave this person airtime and didn't haul her over the coals and require her to justify the statement and explain how she came to that conclusion. If we do not follow the decision of the referendum democracy in this country is well and truly screwed.