Cup 430 Club

[Guest]

Picked it up this afternoon. Seemingly it was a supportIng struts for the front diffuser itself and as stated just a new clip on the brake servo hose. 
 

mentioned the rubber lip and the dealership were great and said they’d sort it too as drivers side has beef bagging down a little of late. 
 

Leven Lotus were great and re bonded and placed new black grubbed screws and now my rubber lip looks good as new. 
 

don’t know if it’s just a thing for my car re the recall as mine was registered April 2018 best call your dealership with the strut and clip info and see what it says against your chassis number?

forgot to mention Leven Lotus also got the car Geo tweeked in the summer for me and I found a huge difference in on road feel after completed. Less manic. 

[schubacca13]

@Andy 

Thank you.

Could somebody share the ground clearance with/without the lip?

My dealer said the car is still practical to use without scratching every 5 kilometres, hope it's true 😂

Edited December 19, 2019 by schubacca13

[TerryCTR]

On 17/12/2019 at 14:24, Andy Norman said:

No problem. Excellent decision getting the 430. I had a demo 410 on a few occasions and it certainly didn’t have the same theatre as the 430CUP. 

What do you feel the 410 is missing Andy? Lovely car btw, hopefully I get to see it in the flesh next year if you attend Lotus meets etc.

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, TerryCTR said:

What do you feel the 410 is missing Andy? Lovely car btw, hopefully I get to see it in the flesh next year if you attend Lotus meets etc.

I’m just comparing the walk up feeling, looking in the mirrors and seeing a much smaller wing, narrow air intakes, no carbon lid on the one I was lent on a few occasions. Now however the 410 appears to have matured some what from the original ones. I always thought for only a little extra the CUP was an obvious go to car for potential buyers. Given the way these 410’s have been flying out of the forecourts though...... what do I know. 
 

Regarding meet ups, yes, would like to attend more Or even some tbh, but 3 kids 6, 4 and 8 months makes commitment difficult atm so if I do attend it’ll be a last minute affair and will probably involve me bringing my car mad son as well. 

[RRSSS]

Just touching on the front rubber lip topic, I had it removed from mine before collection because I’d seen it drooping on a demo I had and, well, it was obvious back then that the bolts holding it are not up for the job.

As I’ve mentioned to @BatMobile, I’ve picked up a SLIPLO skid plate kit and will see how it fits. Might have a spare set if anyone’s interested 👍

[Nightfire]

It is surprising that there is still no official Exige 410 lap time in Hethel. It is probably almost as fast as the 430 CUP with the lap time of 1.24.8. If it really was, it would be difficult to explain the difference in price. Even if it were, I chose the Exige 430 CUP because in my opinion the vehicle is an icon in automotive engineering and will be one of the last of its kind. I love my 430 CUP.

Edited December 20, 2019 by Nightfire

[Martrack]

On 20/12/2019 at 15:14, Nightfire said:

It is surprising that there is still no official Exige 410 lap time in Hethel. It is probably almost as fast as the 430 CUP with the lap time of 1.24.8. If it really was, it would be difficult to explain the difference in price.

I talked about this with the Lotus Technical Specialist some times ago :

Sounds like the main difference is the 430 aerodynamic package with produces more downforce.
Also the additional 430 knob which gives five pre-set traction levels when ESP set to off.
Of course the 20 additional horsepower.
And some default light carbon / titanium pieces (but which can be mounted on both cars).
 
Appart from that, chassis seems to be the same (dampers, anti-roll bars, brakes, weels / tires dimensions).
 
Am I right with this comparison ?
Yes.
Did I miss something ?
No.
 
According to my various readings regarding the chassis, even dampers have the same factory clicks settings on both cars.
But in the 410 description is written : "Nitron dampers have been re-tuned for road use and optimized to suit the car’s unique aerodynamic set-up".
However part number is the same on both cars (A138C0096F).
I'm then not sure what you precisely mean here ?
Marketing talk I imagine!
 
If both cars have the same chassis, I then assume we can set both of them (thanks to their adjustable dampers) to feel equally (on road and track) ?
Then the only difference is that the 430 should be faster in fast corners due to its huge downforce ?
Yes.
 
Finally, you do not specify the 410 Hethel laptime (1:24.8 for the 430) in the documentations.
Does it perhaps mean it was faster (or at least did the same time) ? (it perhaps could as they seem pretty similar)
Probably very similar: Downforce = Drag

 

On 20/12/2019 at 15:14, Nightfire said:

Even if it were, I chose the Exige 430 CUP because in my opinion the vehicle is an icon in automotive engineering and will be one of the last of its kind.

I do agree about the iconic aspect the 430 may have over the 410... because it's the last of the series.

[Tex]

33 minutes ago, Martrack said:

I talked about this with the Lotus Technical Specialist some times ago :

Sounds like the main difference is the 430 aerodynamic package with produces more downforce.
Also the additional 430 knob which gives five pre-set traction levels when ESP set to off.
Of course the 20 additional horsepower.
And some default light carbon / titanium pieces (but which can be mounted on both cars).
 
Appart from that, chassis seems to be the same (dampers, anti-roll bars, brakes, weels / tires dimensions).
 
Am I right with this comparison ?
Yes.
Did I miss something ?
No.
 
According to my various readings regarding the chassis, even dampers have the same factory clicks settings on both cars.
But in the 410 description is written : "Nitron dampers have been re-tuned for road use and optimized to suit the car’s unique aerodynamic set-up".
However part number is the same on both cars (A138C0096F).
I'm then not sure what you precisely mean here ?
Marketing talk I imagine!
 
If both cars have the same chassis, I then assume we can set both of them (thanks to their adjustable dampers) to feel equally (on road and track) ?
Then the only difference is that the 430 should be faster in fast corners due to its huge downforce ?
Yes.
 
Finally, you do not specify the 410 Hethel laptime (1:24.8 for the 430) in the documentations.
Does it perhaps mean it was faster (or at least did the same time) ? (it perhaps could as they seem pretty similar)
Probably very similar: Downforce = Drag

 

I do agree about the iconic aspect the 430 may have over the 410... because it's the last of the series.

The average track driver is probably not going to find much difference on Hethel between a 430 and a 410. 
 

Having said that it is very unlikely that anyone is going to spec a 410 to 430 spec as it is going to cost over £15,000 and therefore the 430 is likely to be 15-20 kg lighter  standard.

Not considerable but when you factor in the increase aero, extra 20 odd bhp, stiffer chassis courtesy of the rollover loop and a pro driver there will be a time difference. As previously posted it was more likely Lotus did not provide a Hethel time because the 410 was faster than the Cup 380 which many dealers still had new stock of at the time !!

 

[BatMobile]

11 hours ago, Tex said:

The average track driver is probably not going to find much difference on Hethel between a 430 and a 410. 
 

Having said that it is very unlikely that anyone is going to spec a 410 to 430 spec as it is going to cost over £15,000 and therefore the 430 is likely to be 15-20 kg lighter  standard.

Not considerable but when you factor in the increase aero, extra 20 odd bhp, stiffer chassis courtesy of the rollover loop and a pro driver there will be a time difference. As previously posted it was more likely Lotus did not provide a Hethel time because the 410 was faster than the Cup 380 which many dealers still had new stock of at the time !!

 

This is what I heard, the 430 on track was quite a bit quicker due to the weight saving, aero and apparently most are closer to 440bhp than 430bhp so it’s enough of a difference.

it was down to the 380 cup sitting on dealers forecourts but also a view that they had been screwed over enough with a 410 being launched at a lower price than the 380 cup was by the previous leadership. 

[Martrack]

17 hours ago, Tex said:

Having said that it is very unlikely that anyone is going to spec a 410 to 430 spec as it is going to cost over £15,000 and therefore the 430 is likely to be 15-20 kg lighter  standard.

 

Well, I did, at least on paper, and I'm hesitating to do so.
I then took eurozone price list, as of 01/01/2019.
Prices in euros, excluding VAT.

Cup 430                    : 108,403

Sport 410                  :  83,613
Titanium exhaust           :   6,134
Carbon fibre hardtop       :   3,361
Carbon fibre rear diffuser :   1,345
--------------------------   -------
Sport 410+                 :  94,453 (-13,950)

Carbon fibre sill covers   :   1,345             Carbon fibre barge boards :   3,277
--------------------------   -------             -------------------------   -------
Sport 410++1               :  95,798 (-12,605)   Sport 410++2              :  97,730 (-10,673)

So sounds like a Sport 410+ is 16,740 € (inc VAT) less than a Cup 430.
But we then miss the 20 additional HP, additional downforce and the ESP knob.
There are also some body differences such as the bigger rear wing, aero holes, bigger air intakes, but these are more related to personal taste / preferences.

We could then spec a track focused Sport 410++ with exterior engine isolator & fire extinguisher, roll cage A frame, harnesses... for less than a Cup 430 (and looking like the 380 thanks to the barge boards).
So from my point of view the price difference is hard to justifiy.
But I'm still scratching my head choosing between the two, because of the iconic aspect of the Cup 430

Edited December 22, 2019 by Martrack

[Akajak]

Don’t forget the carbon side pods , and carbon instrument binnacle 🙂

[Akajak]

Excluding on the road costs

410 79900

430 100600

[Tex]

1 hour ago, Martrack said:

Well, I did, at least on paper, and I'm hesitating to do so.
I then took eurozone price list, as of 01/01/2019.
Prices in euros, excluding VAT.

Cup 430                    : 108,403

Sport 410                  :  83,613
Titanium exhaust           :   6,134
Carbon fibre hardtop       :   3,361
Carbon fibre rear diffuser :   1,345
--------------------------   -------
Sport 410+                 :  94,453 (-13,950)

Carbon fibre sill covers   :   1,345             Carbon fibre barge boards :   3,277
--------------------------   -------             -------------------------   -------
Sport 410++1               :  95,798 (-12,605)   Sport 410++2              :  97,730 (-10,673)

So sounds like a Sport 410+ is 16,740 € (inc VAT) less than a Cup 430.
But we then miss the 20 additional HP, additional downforce and the ESP knob.
There are also some body differences such as the bigger rear wing, aero holes, bigger air intakes, but these are more related to personal taste / preferences.

We could then spec a track focused Sport 410++ with exterior engine isolator & fire extinguisher, roll cage A frame, harnesses... for less than a Cup 430 (and looking like the 380 thanks to the barge boards).
So from my point of view the price difference is hard to justifiy.
But I'm still scratching my head choosing between the two, because of the iconic aspect of the Cup 430

As mentioned above there are other additional Carbon the Cup 430 has and also the Carbon Cills. As well as a number of other differences T45 etc !!

It is of course a matter of personal choice and some 410 owners and prospective purchasers will justify the lower outlay for a 410 as the fact the Cup 430 is similar, which of course it is!!

But a 911 GT3 RS is a superior track car to a 911 GT3 , same with the Cup430 to a 410

 

[Edinburgh 111s]

 

3 hours ago, Tex said:

As mentioned above there are other additional Carbon the Cup 430 has and also the Carbon Cills. As well as a number of other differences T45 etc !!

It is of course a matter of personal choice and some 410 owners and prospective purchasers will justify the lower outlay for a 410 as the fact the Cup 430 is similar, which of course it is!!

But a 911 GT3 RS is a superior track car to a 911 GT3 , same with the Cup430 to a 410

 

On what basis is the cup 430 more track focused ? It’s not like the old Lotus motorsport  built cup cars. It is in essence a 410 with a larger wing, slightly upgraded aero and extra carbon with +20hp. Track times I suspect will be very similar. 

I prefer the look of the 430 cup and would consider one if the right example comes to the market. But I don’t think it’s any more track focused or vastly different to the 410. I do believe they will hold their value better being the last true analogue Lotus before the new era cars come online.  

[Tex]

39 minutes ago, Edinburgh 111s said:

 

On what basis is the cup 430 more track focused ? It’s not like the old Lotus motorsport  built cup cars. It is in essence a 410 with a larger wing, slightly upgraded aero and extra carbon with +20hp. Track times I suspect will be very similar. 

I prefer the look of the 430 cup and would consider one if the right example comes to the market. But I don’t think it’s any more track focused or vastly different to the 410. I do believe they will hold their value better being the last true analogue Lotus before the new era cars come online.  

Not sure what your point is !

A whole list of differences listed between the 2 , see all the above and previous posts. 

[Edinburgh 111s]

1 hour ago, Tex said:

Not sure what your point is !

A whole list of differences listed between the 2 , see all the above and previous posts. 

My point is that you stated that the 430 is a track focused car, moreover than the 410. My point is that this isn’t really the case. 

[Tex]

7 hours ago, Edinburgh 111s said:

My point is that you stated that the 430 is a track focused car, moreover than the 410. My point is that this isn’t really the case. 

Well your point is wrong !!!

[C8RKH]

@Edinburgh 111s If you read about the two models on the Lotus website it certainly comes across that the 430 CUP is aimed squarely at on track performance whilst being OK on the road, whereas the 410 is aimed more at on road performance whilst being great on the track.  Increased front and rear downforce on the 430, variable traction etc. The performance figures are near identical in a straight line which sort of reinforces the view of more downforce for the 430 Cup. It's also the way Pistonheads and several other reviews see it as THE most track focused Exige.

So all in all, I would say the 430 CUP is more track focused and the constant "motorsport" references to it, as opposed to the 410, certainly seem to bear that out. The details may be small, but if I look at my own 410 Sport Evora, versus an Evora 400, the detailed differences were small but the laptime difference was quite large at Hethel.

At the end of the day, both are fantastic cars but if I had the extra cash and was in the market the 430 Cup would win it for me every time.

[BatMobile]

All exiges are arguably track focussed I guess but the 430 is just the most focussed of them all, and for me the best looking/most aggressive. 
 

i have found myself just opening the garage for a quick look at it! 

[Edinburgh 111s]

1 hour ago, BatMobile said:

All exiges are arguably track focussed I guess but the 430 is just the most focussed of them all, and for me the best looking/most aggressive. 
 

i have found myself just opening the garage for a quick look at it! 

I agree with your comments. I also think the 430 is the best looking Exige.... a black 430 in particular .... the hunt continues 😀

[Tex]

8 hours ago, Edinburgh 111s said:

I agree with your comments. I also think the 430 is the best looking Exige.... a black 430 in particular .... the hunt continues 😀

You may be hunting for quite some time as only 4 black Cup 430’s so far produced with 3 of the owners on here  

[Akajak]

1 hour ago, Tex said:

You may be hunting for quite some time as only 4 black Cup 430’s so far produced with 3 of the owners on here  

Where do you get the colours and numbers from   ?

[TerryCTR]

10 hours ago, Edinburgh 111s said:

I agree with your comments. I also think the 430 is the best looking Exige.... a black 430 in particular .... the hunt continues 😀

A black 430 cup would be the top choice for me although I’d happily settle for a 410 and all the carbon trimmings!

[Guest]

Any of you other 430 guys experienced a yellow spanner hanging around on start up. Mine did today for about 15-20s after all other lights turned off. 
No drop in performance noticed, no misfires etc. Took the car Edinburgh to St Andrews and back approx 100 miles to blow out the cobwebs. Got back cleaned dried and started up again to get everything warm and water evaporated from rads for 20 mins and again 20sec illumination of yellow spanner! 
I’ll head down to Craig Moncreif Cars in a few days if it doesn’t disappear. 

[TerryCTR]

Maybe something similar to what’s mentioned in this thread?