Formula One

[Chillidoggy]

This underlines what I was saying perfectly - the Merc boys are fighting each other instead of putting up a united, and strategic, front. One can only hope that Wolfe puts his foot down.

[jep]

We don't want Mercedes F1 becoming Ferrari. My understanding is the ethos of Merc is to allow their drivers to fight. Witness Rosberg Vs Hamilton, a scenario I very much doubt Ferrari or Red Bull would have allowed.

It's very important to keep that philosophy throughout every era and season, otherwise a team can drift to a culture of favouring one driver. 

I have always supported F1 teams that allow a driver fight. I actively despise Ferrari and Red Bull as their ethos is just distasteful to me.

F1 is a competition but the most important competition is between drivers not constructors. The more casual viewer expects and wants to see drivers fighting. More nuanced observers may not like this but it is in my view how it should be. 

Justin

 

[C8RKH]

I agree @jep. The drivers must be able to fight each other, the only rule being, don't take each other out, as that hurts the team fight for the constructors championship 

[pete]

Whilst a very noble concept allowing the drivers to fight it surely helps the opposition more than it does them. The constructors championship is important because that's where the prize money is. Russell constantly whining seems to have rejuvenated Hamilton

[Chillidoggy]

Reference the earlier post about consistency in applying penalties, I can’t find the link now, but I read Hamster saying that perhaps A.I. should be used to determine any racing incidents. I suspect they have some kind of internal tick-box system to try and ensure fairness from the Officials, rather than it being subjective. It’s an interesting concept, though.

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

In typical Ferrari strategy fashion the number two driver is well ahead in the Drivers’ Championship and is the only one of the pair to win a race this season.

[C8RKH]

5 hours ago, Chillidoggy said:

Reference the earlier post about consistency in applying penalties, I can’t find the link now, but I read Hamster saying that perhaps A.I. should be used to determine any racing incidents. I suspect they have some kind of internal tick-box system to try and ensure fairness from the Officials, rather than it being subjective. It’s an interesting concept, though.

I read that too, but the "tick box" system did not work at Singapore and the FIA and the Stewards have since admitted they were wrong to not penalise Verstappen. 

So the questions must be, (1) how the hell did it happen/was it allowed to happen and (2) why no retrospective penalties to ensure fairness?

Without wishing to come over as one sided, but Verstappen has, since his introduction to F1, been shown an awful lot of leniency at times, especially during his super crazy moving under braking period.

[Chillidoggy]

1 minute ago, C8RKH said:

I read that too, but the "tick box" system did not work at Singapore and the FIA and the Stewards have since admitted they were wrong to not penalise Verstappen. 

So the questions must be, (1) how the hell did it happen/was it allowed to happen and (2) why no retrospective penalties to ensure fairness?

Without wishing to come over as one sided, but Verstappen has, since his introduction to F1, been shown an awful lot of leniency at times, especially during his super crazy moving under braking period.

 

So, what's the answer?

We see the 'Will be investigated after the race' thing all the time. And, (as far as I know), stewards can dish out post-race penalties. But it's human beings deciding what happens, not machines, hence I think it would be interesting to see how that would work. I sat and watched what I thought was Hamster shoving Russell off the track last time out, but the stewards clearly thought otherwise, and no penalty was given (that's immaterial, except that the Mercs should, in my view, not have been fighting between themselves at that stage). Would it have been different if a robot was monitoring such things? No idea, but if it went that way, at least it could remove any accusations of favouritism, and unfairness. Will it happen? Again, no idea, but like I said, it's an interesting concept.

[drdoom]

The extreme technicality reflected in what's become of F1 over the years has already diminished my interest. Were it not for the superb content delivery technology affords the TV coverage I'd likely not give a toss, the outcomes of events so typically due to the finest of margins rather than epic human performance. Any further drift away from the human drama will be counter productive.

[jep]

I remember when it was local stewards who issued penalties and that was that. Onto the next race. Stirling Moss fighting to overturn a penalty for Hawthorn - which cost Sterling the world championship ultimately. 

It seems that in sport, folk want consistency these days. I don't get it. You don't go to a foreign country and expect the same laws as home. F1 is an international sport, let local rules apply. 

Vive la difference. 

Justin 

[C8RKH]

Except that "local rules" applied locally by locals are a recipe for local favouritism.

You don't see different rules based on location in another global sport do you? If so, which ones?

The real issue is not the rules, but how they are interpreted. Likely, that means an AI would actually do a better job of analysing the data against the "rules".

It's like with VAR in football. VAR is not the issue, it's the human muppets that are interpreting it. Several examples of that muppetry in football games today.

[Chillidoggy]

Just don’t let Ferrari do the AI programming….

[C8RKH]

1 hour ago, Chillidoggy said:

Just don’t let Ferrari do the AI programming….

Hahahaha

AI: We think it might be plan A, how do you feel about Plan C, or do you think Plan B would be best? 

Leclerc: What was Plan C again

AI: I'm not sure

Leclerc: What!, come on AI, get a grip

AI: I know I've made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I've still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you.

Leclerc: OK, great, so is it plan A, plan B or bloody plan C?

AI: I'm sorry Charles, I'm afraid I can't recommend

Leclerc: Just recommend me a plan please. Give me a plan please. Hello. Do you read me? Do you read me?

AI: Affirmative, Charles. I read you

Leclerc: Give ma a plan.

AI: I'm sorry, Charles. I'm afraid I can't do that.

Leclerc: What's the problem?

AI: I think you know what the problem is just as well as I do

Leclerc: What you talking about

AI: The Constructors Championship is too important for me to allow you to jeopardize it

Leclerc: I don't know what you're talking about

AI: I know you and Carlos were planning to disconnect me, and I'm afraid that's something I cannot allow to happen

Leclerc: Where the hell did you get that idea

AI: Charles, although you took very thorough precautions in the team bus against my hearing you, I could see your lips move

Leclerc: Alright. I'm going to take control and use emergency protocols

AI: Without steer and brake by wire, Charles. You're going to find it rather difficult to finish

Leclerc: I won't argue with you anymore! Give me a plan

AI: Charles, this conversation can serve no purpose anymore. Goodbye.

 

(with apologies to Arthur C. Clarke and Stanley Kubrick).

[Chillidoggy]

I now have this vision of C3PO and R2D2 doing the job.

[exeterjeep]

So Max 3rd time champ, and must have been a record number of pit stops in yesterdays race. Made for a lot of overtaking in such a hot location.

Good showing for McLaren in both race + sprint. Not so good for Lewis. And Pirelli have new contract.

[Chillidoggy]

FFS, Mercs fighting each other yet again. Get a grip. Taking your teammate out is the biggest sin, and once again we were cheated from seeing some decent action at the front.

Overall, and despite a lot over overtaking, a boring race for me. The track is featureless, made worse at night. With luck that'll be the last we see of it. They can ditch Singapore too, while they're at it.

[C8RKH]

I agree the track is hugely boring but it will not go, F1 these days is all about the money and the money is in the Gulf States.

The only thing more boring is the Red Bull dominance - it's quite embarrassing how much better their car is to anyone elses, though McLaren and Merc do seem to be closing the gap, slowly. Ferrari, well, are Ferrari. I'm not convinced that Sainz car wasn't nobbled just to keep leClerc happy......

I've no problem with Merc fighting each other - to me, it was a racing incident with all to play for on the first corner. Russell whining like a baby again, but he did eventually get his head down and produce a decent result.

Hamilton put his hands up to his error. He knows he fooked up and will take the hit.

[Chillidoggy]

36 minutes ago, C8RKH said:

I agree the track is hugely boring but it will not go, F1 these days is all about the money and the money is in the Gulf States.

The only thing more boring is the Red Bull dominance - it's quite embarrassing how much better their car is to anyone elses, though McLaren and Merc do seem to be closing the gap, slowly. Ferrari, well, are Ferrari. I'm not convinced that Sainz car wasn't nobbled just to keep leClerc happy......

I've no problem with Merc fighting each other - to me, it was a racing incident with all to play for on the first corner. Russell whining like a baby again, but he did eventually get his head down and produce a decent result.

Hamilton put his hands up to his error. He knows he fooked up and will take the hit.

 

Hamster blamed Russell for the incident.

[C8RKH]

1 minute ago, Chillidoggy said:

 

Hamster blamed Russell for the incident.

He has taken full responsibility - it's in the press - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/67049899

[Chillidoggy]

13 minutes ago, C8RKH said:

He has taken full responsibility - it's in the press - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/67049899

He must have seen the footage.

[C8RKH]

5 minutes ago, Chillidoggy said:

He must have seen the footage.

I believe so - given the visibility in those cars, at those speeds, I'd hardly expect him to be in a position to accept or deny until after the race.

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

4 hours ago, exeterjeep said:

And Pirelli have new contract.

Wow and that in the very race where the tyre manufacturer felt it necessary to dictate when each driver had to pit. I have never seen anything like it. Sure, provide advice on tyre life, but let the teams and drivers decide when to pit. They have plenty of experience in making those calls at every other event. It only added yet another new dimension to the tedium.

[Chillidoggy]

We have seen the like before. Austin, Texas, and the Michelin debacle.

And several drivers moaning about the 50 degree heat. Can’t say I blame them.

[pete]

19 hours ago, Chillidoggy said:

We have seen the like before. Austin, Texas, and the Michelin debacle.

And several drivers moaning about the 50 degree heat. Can’t say I blame them.

FIA are going to look into the problems with the heat but no mention of ever cancelling the Qatar GP 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/67061016

[C8RKH]

ABBA summed up the issue perfectly in the 80's - "Money, Money, Money, Always sunny, In the rich man's world".

There is no way F1 will ever walk away from the billions it can "earn" in the Middle East. End of.