London congestion charge reintroduced

[Colin P]

Sorry but if people think that London doesn’t pay its way then I’m not sure there is much to be said. If you think it’s so great I suggest you move here. 
 

We exchanged on Friday, finally moving away. Not as far as I’d like, but away nonetheless. Let someone else put up with living there and fund the country. 

[C8RKH]

Yes, London contributes significantly. We all get that. But as I said before it also has a lot of benefits that other parts of the country don't get. And also, like with you Colin, you can move away from London and find out that actually life outside or away from it, can be great too. Before Covid I probably spent 2/3 days a week in London. I enjoyed working there. I've not missed it though during Covid. I doubt I'll be back down for 2/3 days a week in the future.

London wonderful place. Some great people there too. If only some of them would stop whining about living there, or the cost of living there, or thinking they are better than everyone else lol!

I left a job in London in October 1995 to move "up North" to Scotland. Never looked back. Everyone can make their own choice. And the added benefit for me where I live is that I get subsidised to live up here by London taxpayers.  Super result Just need to make sure Sturgeon never gets independence as would need to move back south to avoid the horrendous tax that I would then have to pay up here. (oh and by the way I pay 5% more income tax than my colleagues in London, so maybe I'm subsiding them?)

 

[KAS-118]

@Colin P - I have to agree with you. As you say London clearly does pay it's way - and the ONS figures identify it subsidies the rest of the UK.

Clearly it needs considerable more money for Public transport - because it is so densely populated (Manchester has a population of 2.7m whereas London is over 8.9m).

Not only that but a considerable number of people travel from quite far outside of London to work, and when they get to a mainline station they the use TfL facilities. For example I know people who travel down from near Norfolk and Wales. There's no one that I know who lives in London but travels the other way. to work in those places and therefore put an increased burden on their Public Transport system

Because of the density, there is limited facilities for private transport - and indeed travelling by car is not only is a lengthy process - its actively discouraged.

Clearly, people have a choice - and for those who live outside London and, according to the ONS are effectively subsidised by Londoners, I think it absurd that they complain about it. As you suggest, if they don't like it they could move to London, pay the extortionate property prices, put up with the noise and the pollution and very high costs of living.

I'm not knocking anyone whop doesn't want to live in London and put up with these things - and there are clearly some benefits from living in London. However, whatever choice you make there is a 'quid pro quo'.

Those who I am exasperated with are the ones (who are a very small minority)  who appear tom have some form of 'chip' on their shoulder and, when London gets money (that not only does it need, but actually deserves considering the surplus it creates)  resort to childish whining saying it's unfair and suggest it shouldn't be given - failing to explain how the economic benefit would be greater if that money was spent elsewhere.

It should also be pointed out that the bus services out of London have received £400m and were receiving an Operators Grant of £251m - so its not as though they've received no money at all.

Clearly, if it were more  efficient, and would create better economic sense, to use the money that TfL got for other places then I'm sure the Government would have done so. But at the end of the day, not only is the use of private transport much more easier in those places - they don''t create the wealth for the County as a whole that London does.

As you say, those who appear to be so 'jealous' and  don't want to 'miss-out' on the money that TfL getting are welcome to move here - but they certainly shouldn't consider it's all 'pro's' and no 'cons'.

At the end of the day I hope the Country can try and pull together to beat this pandemic (and the economic crisis that exists and will no doubt last longer). The Government has limited funds - and therefore will have to spend them the way that provides the most benefit to the country as a whole. I've seen no evidence to suggest its not doing that. 

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by KAS-118

[machine7]

12 hours ago, C8RKH said:

London like all capital cities benefits immensely from the fact that it is the centre of power - both politically and financially. The people in the capital have always faired better than the people in the outer lying regions. Struggling to find a civilisation or country where this is not the case.

Washington D.C. vs New York and Canberra vs Sydney. Seems like financial beats political in those instances. Although Washington D.C. is probably catching up with all the pressure groups and vested interests.

[C8RKH]

Good point had not thought about those too. So Financial beats Political, but when you have both, like say London, you batter everyone else? Feels like it.

[Sizona]

On 16/05/2020 at 18:48, pete said:

@Sizonalooks like roads around you are going to banned to cars and vans

Yes seems Old Street itself is going to only be for buses, motorbikes and bicycles. Fair enough but again traffic around there isn't bad at all even at normal times.

Also to add to previous comments I agree that CC needs to be in operation during the working week and 7am - 6pm is fine. But SEVEN days until 10pm is just a cash machine for making money. Minimal traffic in central London in evenings and weekends so nothing to do with congestion imo. If really pushed I could agree adding Saturday 7am to 6pm and leave Sunday all day free. 

[SFO]

18 hours ago, jep said:

ULEZ is wider than Congestion Charge zone. ULEZ is out to A406 North Circ and A205 South Circ. Basically, no 80s or 90s cars can come in to that zone now but check NOx rating. CC zone is much smaller

ULEZ zone is currently the same as congestion charge zone. ULEZ expands to NCR and SCR in October 2021

[jep]

@SFO spot on and thanks for the correction. Brain-scramble from me, for some reason I had March 2020 in my head. I think I got confused as I like to take the Elise to RAC SW1 on occasion, so got ahead of the game. Thanks for the correction. Great news, as can still use by 1986 R5 GT Turbo in SW6 until Oct 21. And commute in the Excel..…….wasted trip yesterday but SHMBO drove the Elan back from SW6 and I did not see her again for 2 hours.....she went off on a jaunt. 

Justin

[ChrisJ]

ULEZ is expanding to the M25 next month

Couple of interesting videos about air quality.

 

 

[jep]

Not to the M25. Surrey is not included as it is not a London borough, parts of Surrey are inside the M25. As are other counties.

It is all London boroughs. 

Justin 

[pete]