Lotus Evora 400

[Bibs]

They read all of the reviews, pretty much without exception. They also visit various forums inc TLF and do listen to what people have to say. I'm not sure they care so much for the opinions of tube drivers though

[Mark Blanchard]

Hi Bibs, wow that's cool, I'm glad to hear!  So they know the Evora GTE has gone down very, very well with Lotus enthusiasts?

[Bibs]

They know they sold them all and they know that 50% of the owners are members of TLF

[brightoncorgi]

Name brand association goes a long way in justifying the price.  Just like keeping AP branding on the calipers or mentioning the seats, shocks, and springs by name.  Give validity to areas Lotus is not a manufacturer in.

[Suddabym]

Can I be controversial for a moment, regarding the comparison of the 'GTE' and the 400?

 

Looks are subjective, and I certainly agree that the 'GTE' is a good looking car.  But it is a stylised car, not, I would argue, an engineered car.  Whereas, I think the 400 is a fully engineered and tested replacement for the current model.

 

I fully accept the work that Lotus motorsport did make the 'GTE' cars saleable, but let's not forget they were originally stillborn and could not be made to work.  They were a Dany Bahar (bless him) Chinese marketing exercise that didn't come off.

 

In a sense then the 'GTE' (which was never launched - the cars that were originally built as GTEs were sold as GT350's) represented an evolutionary dead-end for the Evora, where as the 400 is the properly planned and thought through evolutionary next step.

 

I therefore, find it strange when they are compared (as if they are stable mates) and questions are asked if the 400 will somehow, one day morph in the 'GTE'.  Why would it?  The GTE never happened.  It couldn't be made to work.  Lotus Motorsport took the old cars and reworked them so that some of the original investment could be recovered.  The original GTE was a failed marketing exercise (and a pretty one); the GT350 are 20 cars that have been reworked and rebuilt to recover some cash and prevent these lovely looking cars from being scraped; and the 400 is the next generation of Evora platform.

 

The 400 looks may divide in a way that the 'GTE' does not, but the 400 looks the way it does for good, solid, engineering reasons.  And isn't that the one thing above all that we, as Lotus enthusiasts, love about Lotus?  Otherwise, wouldn't we all be driving more 'fashionable' cars? The 'GTE' look was created by Mansory, a 'fashion house'.

 

All of this is just a personal opinion, of course.  And, I am certainly not seeking to annoy those that have bought GT350's, they are fantastic cars and I wish I could have afforded such a rare beauty, but they are not the original GTE, nor can they be comparable (I would argue) to the 400, which is going in an entirely different (fully engineered) direction.

 

Awesome,

 

Sudders

[TBD]

As a GTE-owner I acutally have to agree with Sudders. The GTE is a very special edition that as a whole should not be compared to the Evora 400. The Evora 400 could never have the extended width of the 400 and the GTE wing looks ridiculous as a stock option.

 

However, the GTE does show what could have been and I think many are disappointed by the fact that the GTE styling cues were not picked up on. True, Mansory may be a "fashion house", but it seems they got it right the first time, whereas the Evora 400 doesn't seem "complete." The new pieces don't seem to blend very well with the original design.

 

Lastly, don't hold the failed marketing exercise against the GTE. The car was canned in a time when Lotus was in turmoil and priorities were different. Specifically the funds to complete the drivetrain design weren't there. But, the decision to bring the prototypes back to life using the stock drivetrain was a smart move.

 

The 20 Evora GTE now built will eternally remain as a piece of Lotus heritage showing "what could have been."

[Suddabym]

Thomas - totally with you dude. Your car rocks.

Damn! How to kill a thread. What was I thinking?

Right, that's it. I'm not doing serious anymore. It scares people.

Bring back Dany. I understood the world when Dany was in charge. JMG has turned me into a gimp.

I'm off to Turkey to find Dany.

Bye

[FredP]

https://youtu.be/i6aRjIu6m54

[NedaSay]

Thomas - totally with you dude. Your car rocks.

Damn! How to kill a thread. What was I thinking?

Right, that's it. I'm not doing serious anymore. It scares people.

Bring back Dany. I understood the world when Dany was in charge. JMG has turned me into a gimp.

I'm off to Turkey to find Dany.

Bye

 

I heard Dany  could be found around Mayfair these days selling overpriced slightly modified posh cars to the uber rich...

[Jack Stone]

Ok I'm old skool but I prefer alloy coloured alloys and it looks like the launch 400's wheels are now out of date as (according to latest spec on Lotus website) gloss black is now standard and no options offered. Is that correct?

[hyteck9]

I put my esprit v8 up for sale today to make room for the 400. Dealer says they can't take orders yet though. anxious! !!

[Gm77]

Jack

As best I can work out, the black wheels on the launch vehicles are the standard ones and are cast. Options for forged wheels, either diamond cut (silver) or black, are available. Still waiting on the configurator though to confirm.

Greg

[Mark Blanchard]

I think many are disappointed by the fact that the GTE styling cues were not picked up on. True, Mansory may be a "fashion house", but it seems they got it right the first time, whereas the Evora 400 doesn't seem "complete." The new pieces don't seem to blend very well with the original design.

 

I agree.  I'd liked to have seen some of the GTE splitter in the 400.  Not that it counts for anything but here's my Photoshop impression of what it could have looked like:

 

[Snoopy1969]

@@@@ Mark, very interesting, stunning work in my eyes! More Lotus and not so much Audi R8...as the evora 400. But tastes are different of course, lets see how we like it in the plastic....

( what about - if you are bored and/ or have too much time.. ;-) ...- a two color rear of the 3-11 photoshoped on the Evora 400????)

[Snoopy1969]

Regarding the wheels : the black ones actually shown are rated as "lightweight, forged" by Lotus on their instagram account. So mybe the silver ones on the first silver Evora 400 were the "new standard"?

[Mark Blanchard]

@@@@ Mark, very interesting, stunning work in my eyes! More Lotus and not so much Audi R8...as the evora 400. But tastes are different of course, lets see how we like it in the plastic....

 

To me that photoshop is the obvious design to do, as it kind of relates to the cars in the range.  But my guess is Lotus wanted something different / more identifiable.  To me the design they have looks a bit jarring, but maybe it's more future proof.  A bit like when new cars come out they look strange, but after a while you begin to like them.

[NedaSay]

I agree.  I'd liked to have seen some of the GTE splitter in the 400.  Not that it counts for anything but here's my Photoshop impression of what it could have looked like:

 

 

I think this is a very interesting design... Very nice photoshop but I do personally think that if they front end design of the E400 is what it is as it's mostly the result of a conscious decision on behalf of the management at Hethel not to reuse any of previous regime design which for all intent and purposes is one car : the GTE, as the exige S was all but finished when DB tookover.

 

I also think that the design crew experimented a bit with E400 before reverting to the classic - if tweaked - front end on the new 3Eleven which very well might be the way of the future, tweaked from models to models,  but the classic Lotus mouth will rule supreme again albeit with a very flat upper lip for aerodynamic purposes...

[Breeze]

Going back a few pages here, the perceived quality of German made cars was a real and absolute thing.... but back in the 1970's when the Brits where making little jems like the Alegro, Marina, Hunter and Avenger. Not forgetting wonderful products from our partners such as the Talbot Tagora or Chrysler 180. The Austin Ambassador and Princess or indeed the wonderful, but sadly self resolving XJ6. Lets be honest here, all British cars of that time were utter rubbish, even the good ones! Cars like the VW's and BMW not to mention Porsche were in a different league in terms of quality and engineering.

However.... over the last few years they have done what the British Motor cycle industry did in the 60's. They've rested on their laurels ,and basked in the certain knowledge that their cars are so superior to everything else... that they haven't noticed that others have caught them up, and passed them in many respects. I notice that Mercedes and Porsche are infact amongst the least reliable marques currently in production.

Regarding Lotus, It's a hand made vehicle, not something assembled by robot. For that reason alone, like any other hand built car currently made, it will never meet the uniformity of production as a car made by machines. The advantage of a hand assembled car is that it can be made using quality components which would not be suitable for mass production, like the wonderful suspension wishbones for example. Sure Porsche do these as well, but only to go on their hand built, competition use only, vehicles. 

So, for me, I think there are some very unfair comments made by trying to directly compare a Lotus with some other very diverse mega companies. I have an Evora S, the old, slow, fat and lardy one, with the instruments you can't see and the buttons you can't find ( after a couple of days you work it out!). There's no way I'd ever change it for a Merc, Audi or a Porsche ( been there already...ditto Ferrari..also cr*p!). It is a stunningly good car, that has totally exceeded all my expectations. I love the way it drives and its looks, and so apparently  do all the people who stop to ask questions and admire. I don't ever recall that happening with a Porsche!  So, despite some saying it's an awkward design garnished with bad construction quality and cheap fittings, in the real world this doesn't seem to be true. Those of us who have actually bought one, and do drive them each day, can and do attest, it's a very, very good and enjoyable car in every respect. If the E400 is in fact hugely better, it would be about as good as you could get without spending out for a McLaren, Lambo or Ferrari. And even then, would spending twice the money really be worth it... I very much doubt it!

[DaveC72]

What a great post.

 

I'll be honest and say I've found the "downer" on the "the old, slow, fat and lardy one, with the instruments you can't see and the buttons you can't find" that the current crop of reviews has given out has been hard to read.

 

Evo (the one magazine I really rate - and which incidentally as we know made the original N/A it's 2009 ECOTY) published it's fuller review in print this month of the E400.  The review is largely excellent, but perhaps overly dismissive of the previous car.  Admittedly the game has moved on the intervening years, so to expect the original five star reviews (for both the N/A and the S)  to be kept might be unfair - but to give the newer, much improved car less stars seems disingenuous at best.  It scored 4.5.

 

By contrast, the Porsche Boxster Spyder (damn if my spell checker isn't having a field day with that name) comes across as a car that needs to be pushed hard to unleash it's potential, and seems to do no one thing particularly well, gets 5 stars.  Go figure.

 

Coming back to Martin's point (somewhat circuitously, admittedly), there are plenty of cars that don't quite make a reviewer altogether happy, unless they are a particular Marque it would seem.  Real world experience would suggest that the drivers of said cars, disagree.  Were they as difficult to get on with as the reviews suggest, we/they probably would have moved on.

 

1000 odd miles a month and muscle memory now gets me to the right button, sliding the seats back to get in and out is second nature, checking my mirrors more than I used to (hardly a bad habit) and knowing that a gear change is coming and getting it right for the corner have all become part of my driving style.  None of these are problematic, and it could be argued have made me a better driver (NB I am in no way staking a claim for godlike driving prowess) as a result.

 

Every passenger I've ever had, most of which have ended up taking a turn at the wheel, have been blown away by the car.

Have I at any stage regretted my choice?

 

I'm not pig headed enough to not admit a mistake - after all, I used to own an MG C, so mistakes have been made.

 

No.  Not in any way.  The previous Evora remains an outstanding car.  Hats off to Lotus in producing something so genuinely different and enjoyable.

[C8RKH]

Prefect post Breeze and great follow up DaveC72.

 

Just about sums up why I love my Evora and why, as only a recent Lotus convert, I love what the brand stands for.

 

I have an Evora NA, older, slower, fatter and lardier than your S. I swither and dither daily - do I upgrade it or wait and buy an E400? Bugger, not sure what to do, the only thing I do know is that it is highly likely that my Evora will be replaced with, erm, hmmm, another Evora  Unless of course I can find an Original Esprit Essex Turbo in tip-top condition for £30k.....   

[Snoopy1969]

Great Posts, I wish I could add something but I have no time, as I am still trying to find out which knob is for what function in my car.............. ;-)

 

(of course after driving a car some time you should be able to reach the Buttons without looking at them.....when they are out of metal - much better...:-)

[Jack Stone]

I drove a "Turbo Esprit" for 21 years followed by a GT3 for another 2. Adored them both but while my Evora S might lack some of the dramatic presence of Giugiaro's wedge (which is still very evident in the GT3), it is at least an order of magnitude better than its predecessors by every other measure.

The biggest challenge when you've owned an Evora is trying to work out what you could possibly replace it with (for similar money) - other than a younger and/or later iteration.

[Al]

Great posts on previous page Breeze and DaveC72.  My thoughts entirely.

 

We are over in Arran staying with friends in a holiday cottage.  He has a V6S F type and the Evora was sitting in front of it in the drive as we sat outside on the piss on the decking at 5 tonight in the one bit of sun we have had, and 4 of us chatting and not about cars and out of the blue he says "what a stunning car the Evora is from every aspect eh?"  No need for the comment but sys it all.

[PaulCP]

The trouble with motoring journalists is that they are like sheep. If one makes a remark about something the others have to follow since they don't want to expose the fact they they really know crap all about the cars they are driving.

Are they going to upset the manufacturers who invite them to exotic locations, all expenses paid? Of course they are not for fear of not being on the list next time.

Hidden buttons are a feature of most mainstream cars. I would have to fiddle, look and take my eyes off the road to find certain button functions on my Range Rover Sport, same with previous BMWs etc

Perceived German build quality is just that, perceived!

The intertior of my BMW back in 2009 squeaked & rattled after 10k miles, the problem with Porsche Boxter engines gets washed over etc. A former VX owner who took delivery of a new Porsche Boxter in March, following a lengthy wait, has so far driven 900 miles in it. It has been problematic mechanical wise and was offered to him on the day of collection with various paint defects (a quite disgusting approach by a dealer of a so called "premium marque")

[C8RKH]

Good points Paul and re your last point about the dealer - well many of us have heard and/or experienced of so called "premium" dealers like Mercedes who have a particularly (well?) deserved reputation for their, shall we say arrogance and poor customer service?

 

I don't believe that any one of us on this forum, as Lotus owners, believe that Lotus and their cars are perfect and the company and their dealers can do no wrong. Quite the opposite. But I have read time and time of the number of "good" stories where Lotus and the Dealer have gone the extra mile to keep the customer happy. Yes, ideally, these problems would not happen in the first place, but given the size and financial / manpower constraints Lotus have I do think they do a great job in the round. The problem is how many of the "journalists" actually "own" their car and how many actually "own" a Lotus.