Changing rear link arms, compress springs?

[Jacques]

Hi all,

I am about to change the upper and lower link arms.

Before I try this, should I compress the suspension spring on the side I will work on first? Or is it not needed to do, before taking off nuts and wind the long stud out.

Kind regards,

jacques.

[Barrykearley]

Good luck with the long stud..... Will be interested in how you get on as its a job on my spring list

[Jacques]

Hi Barry, that was fast! It's on my Winter list, and not Spring list, as I may need time to solve problems, so I can get driving in the Spring

I still need to know if I need to compress springs on damper, before I work on the rest, or I can just "slide" the lower end of the damper off, with relative ease?

I will jack the car up at the rear end first, of course.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

 

[Chillidoggy]

I didn't need to compress the rear springs when I did the lower rear bushes, and changed the lower damper bushes There was a bit of grunting and careful application of a copper/hide mallet, as I recall. You may have to use a long bar as a lever, just to get it positioned correctly, though. So, yes, they did 'slide' off.

 

 

[Jacques]

Man, you're fast too. Thanks Guys. I'll begin after lunch then.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[Chillidoggy]

Fast?

It just so happened that I was in the right place, at the right time!

[Jacques]

Ha ha, I hope that goes for my rear hub carrier studs too

Jacques.

[Jacques]

Well, here's an update. I managed to take off the lower link stud, no problem, as it could just be winded out.

I had new lower and upper link arms ready with pressed in Lotac red bushings, but I couldn't find a way to propperly have both ends installed (Stud in one end, bolt at the short end).

Are there some good tricks to do this?

The sleve in the rear hub carrier seesm to sit pretty tight, so I think I am going to hacksaw it out.

Will the sliding forth and back give enough distance to wiggle the right angle for the stud to pass, even though it's at an angle? As it is now, either the long stud end or the shorter bolt end sits at an angle that isnot aligned to the other components, they are suposed to be bolted together with.

To try to overcome this, I have tried to lower and raise the hub carrier or tried to angle it, but it's not enough.

Good advices are most wellcome.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

 

[Advantage]

The sleeve moves inside the hole. Don't hacksaw it! Either use mole grips to loosen it or a spare nut & stud/bolt combination to pull it back enough to give you room.

[Jacques]

I hear what you are saying, but my sleve is stuck, Wont budge with some big grips, so next I will have to produce a puller of some sort.

I think that once moving, or having replaced the sleve, it will be a bit easier to twist the lower link arm a bit to gain correct position to slot through the bolt at the other end (short end under engine).

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[sailorbob]

The slotted sleeves were stuck on mine so I carefully cut a groove in them (not all the way through) and then crushed them in on themselves and pressed them out.

Also, I found it easiest to assemble everything onto the hub carrier, next fit the top arm to the chassis and then the bottom arm to the chassis. It takes a bit a time to find the sweet spot for the hub carrier height that minimises the misalignment for the last bolt (I never found any point that wasn't misaligned). I fitted the damper last of all by aligning it with the stud hole in the hub carrier and them sliding the stud into damper mounting hole.

[Vanya]

Silly question but, how are you all compressing your springs on assembly? Every thread I've read on the subject seem to make it sound as dangerous as disarming a live atomic bomb. Are coil compressors even necessary? I don't think they are on the OE Turbo SE coilovers but I've also read some people having rears that didn't need 'em...

[sailorbob]

IIRC correctly I used spring compressors when I removed the OE springs but found there was little preload on the front springs. When I assembled the Lotac springs/dampers I had to use spring compressors.

[Chillidoggy]

Exactly as per Derek's post, you can cut the steel sleeves to remove them. In fact there was no other way to get mine out, they were seized solid. It's a delicate procedure, I used an air hacksaw with a cut-down hacksaw blade, then persuaded them with a parallel pin punch and mallet. They eventually gave in, but it took a while. It would have been quicker, but Sparky was helping me.

Make sure the new split sleeves are positioned correctly in the carriers, too.

[Jacques]

And how is that position?

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[MrDangerUS]

12 hours ago, Vanya said:

Silly question but, how are you all compressing your springs on assembly? Every thread I've read on the subject seem to make it sound as dangerous as disarming a live atomic bomb. Are coil compressors even necessary? I don't think they are on the OE Turbo SE coilovers but I've also read some people having rears that didn't need 'em...

It is much easier and safer doing it  with the nice sturdy column type compressor, like this Goplus® MacPherson Interchangable Fork Strut Coil Spring Compressor Extractor Tool Set. Check Amazon.com, $89.

You can hold it in place with one hand and tighten the screw with the other. It goes even easier, if you have a M12 power ratchet.

Edited January 25, 2016 by MrDangerUS

[Sparky]

Agreed, nice tool - I've got one - but entirely unnecessary for the rears if your setup is standard as there's virtually no load on them.  Fronts are a different story!

[Chillidoggy]

10 hours ago, Jacques said:

And how is that position?

Kind regards,

Jacques.

 

This is how I did mine:-

Before you fit the hub, first I'd recommend fitting up the radius arm inside the two lower lugs to make sure the split sleeve is correctly positioned longitudinally. You don't want any axial movement on the radius arm, so it must be a very good snug fit once the snubbers washers and the radius arm bush are in there (see photo). Gently tap the washers in place before lining it up with the holes, and pushing the lower link pin in to get it lined up. Don't hammer the snubber washers in with any real force though.

Once you've done that, if you find any axial movement on the radius arm, you'll have to move the spilt sleeve to take up the clearance. The sleeve should sit centrally in the lug, but mine was out by just a small amount.

Obviously refer to the service notes with regard torque settings.

 

 

[sailorbob]

You do not need to tap the snubber washers in. Because the split sleeve should be free to slide in the lug you can assemble the bottom arm and washer loosely on the stud and when you tighten the nuts on the stud the sleeve slides inwards to take up the gap.

Position the slot in the sleeve downwards to reduce the amount of water and dirt that accumulates in it.

Edited January 26, 2016 by sailorbob

[Jacques]

yes, I was thinking that too, as there is ample room to insert the two snubber washers, once the split sleeve can slide forth and back.

My main thing is the twisting of the lower link arm, so I think I need to play around with the position of the rear hub carrier, to attain a position where the red Lotac bush (which seems to be thicker than the rubber ones) is aligned with the two holes in the chassis, to slide the bolt through.

I am waiting for new sleeves.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[Chillidoggy]

If the split sleeve is supposed to slide, then I'm very surprised indeed.  Neither of mine did, far from it, in fact they had to be pulled in using stud bar and large spanners. I wouldn't have done that using the lower link pin with the finer thread, but it's up to you.

Here's a photo of how we fitted one of mine.

 

[sailorbob]

The very purpose of the split sleeve is to slide within the lug and prevent any force being applied to the lugs when tightening the nuts on the stud. Without the sliding sleeve you risk compressing the lugs inwards towards each other and fracturing the casting.

[Chillidoggy]

1 hour ago, sailorbob said:

The very purpose of the split sleeve is to slide within the lug and prevent any force being applied to the lugs when tightening the nuts on the stud. Without the sliding sleeve you risk compressing the lugs inwards towards each other and fracturing the casting.

 

If you wind them in using the lower link pin, then you risk doing exactly what you're trying to avoid - excessive sideways loading of the lugs. Check the photo:- they absolutely didn't slide in, in fact I would consider that they were an interference fit, and would have used a press except for the configuration.

But if yours did slide in, then there's also a potential for them to rotate within the alloy lug, and that's not what you want. They need to be solid in there. Did have wear in the lugs, by any chance?

[Sparky]

I've never found one that would slide easily (even when new), therefore I position them carefully prior to link assembly.  Applying too much pressure on that axis doesn't end well.

[sailorbob]

The split sleeves are not freely sliding and you assemble them with anti-seize paste. When done like this the tightening of the nuts on the stud does not exert any inward pressure on the lugs. The split sleeve slides against the snubber washer and firmly clamps the lower arm against the front lug. It's a neat way of ensuring the bottom arm is firmly clamped without needing shims or stressing the lugs.