UK Politics Thread

[C8RKH]

3 hours ago, Kimbers said:

So what do we think of the revelation that Labour talk about fat cats all the time yet employ them at more than the PM gets paid?

 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxgdgkew81o

Is anyone actually surprised at this?

[pete]

[Kimbers]

My wife got £6000 a year after 20 years as a senior nurse. Frankly the above is sickening!

[C8RKH]

4 hours ago, Kimbers said:

Frankly the above is sickening

You want to know why the NHS is stuffed, look no further.

Junior Doctor's striking for a sickening pay rise and demanding even more for the future when they end up, automatically, as top 2% earners in the country. They have a fantastic career path and earning potential in front of them, something that a lot of people would kill for.

The NHS is being held to "ransom" by the few, who already take the most, but want more and more.

We need to break the cycle, and that includes a complete rethinking of primary care and GP surgeries. GP's are as much of the problem as they are the answer.

[Barrykearley]

26 minutes ago, C8RKH said:

Junior Doctor's striking for a sickening pay rise and demanding even more for the future when they end up, automatically, as top 2% earners in the country. They have a fantastic career path and earning potential in front of them, something that a lot of people would kill for.

I agree and disagree. Their end path is amazing and that is beyond doubt.

however - the nhs in their 2 yrs of junior Dr time exploit them timewise and financially. What they are expected to work for after 5 years of intensive and demanding studies in the most horrific and challenging front line roles is simply not enough. Envelope stuffers at the local council get paid better for very little.

the nhs is a complete mess - but to target jnr doctors is a fundamental mistake - the government know full well that all of these highly driven individuals are in huge demand the world over.

[C8RKH]

I don't think they have been specifically targeted by any Government Barry. Show me any industry where an "apprentice" or "junior" isn't exploited at the start of their career. A career they chose, knowing full well the terms, the conditions the pay etc.

It's the same all over the place - you get exploited whilst you learn, you then get to exploit the system once you're through it. Happy days. The problem is that today, noone wants to serve the3 time. to wait. Everyone wants the moolah right now. Gimme, gimme, gimme.

I know, let's change the game.

We'll pay junior doctors more from the outset.

But we'll pay them less during their career.

We'll make them all full time NHS employees, on contracts that means they work 100% for the NHS delivering care to NHS patients, each week, every week.

I bet they'll love that.

[mayevora]

[Kimbers]

2 hours ago, C8RKH said:

I know, let's change the game.

We'll pay junior doctors more from the outset.

But we'll pay them less during their career.

We'll make them all full time NHS employees, on contracts that means they work 100% for the NHS delivering care to NHS patients, each week, every week.

I bet they'll love that.

I don't disagree that Junior Doctors are exploited early in their career and into being a registrar as well. My daughter as a Junior worked such long hours her 30 minute drive home then 30 minute drive back in the next day gave her 4 hours sleep so she just stayed in a room they set aside for junior doctors to sleep in. She did that 4 days a week minimum, sometimes 6.

then as a registrar I was earning twice what she got. Even after a couple of years.

However now she earns more than me and her overtime can be over £700 a day as a consultant (maybe more).

She isn't in an area where she can go and do Private work as she is A&E and Private have no need for that.

So I don't disagree with you Andy. I think a better package for say the first 5 years same for next 5 then less after that......but only if they do Private work. If they work purely for the NHS they should be rewarded to keep them doing just that!

Also understand what Barry says. My wife could have gone to Australia and earnt twice as much as a Staff Nurse as she got here as a Sister and get a much better pension. My Police Friends can earn twice as much nearly as well and with a lower living cost and better pension. Lastly my Daughter could earn so much more in Aus, Canada or even America than here. That's the crux of the matter and the Labour Govt has never understood which is why it wants to tax wealthy people then moan that all the wealthiest British People live in Monaco or Barbados and don't pay tax! DUH!

[C8RKH]

I have no issue paying tax on money that I earn. Until recently I was PAYE all my working life and the amount of tax I was paying was extortionate. but you earn it, you pay it.

It did irk me greatly, and still does, how the self employed and SME company directors can play the system to pay so little in tax.

And I don't see why, for instance, farmers get a "free pass", it would seem, on inheritance tax liabilities around their land etc.

 

But the thing that really pisses me off, hugely, is not the paying of the tax, it is seeing how so much of the public sector just pisses money up the wall. The waste. The inefficiency. The lack of true accountability etc. It is staggering.

The NHS is a huge money pit. It is inefficient. Sub optimal. And in so many ways not fit for purpose. And yet, the rub is that those who make the most money from it, are firmly in control of the levers of power and just refuse to let reforms or changes take over, as they want to keep the status quo. They want to drink the cream from the top. It's a "closed shop" and the same old professions have been milking it since the day it was set up. Don't change anything. just give us more money. That's their strategy. And we not only let them get away with it, but were expected to clap for them too. Total Bollocks!

[exeterjeep]

[pete]

So labour party conference is about to start in Liverpool,any one taking bets on how many times the '22'billion pound black hole is mdntioned

[C8RKH]

Reeves has just been handed a £10bn filler, out of the blue, by her old employer the Bank of England. Just in time to cover the above inflation pay rises she approved, and half the hole!

Lovely. It is really is unwinding very quickly for Labour and we must ask the question if they really did have a plan for Government!

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1950879/rachel-reeves-urged-reverse-winter

[C8RKH]

[pete]

Home office staff in charge of the small boats crisis have been awarded a pay rise of 9%. Wonder how much they would have been awarded if they had actually done their job

[pete]

17 hours ago, pete said:

Home office staff in charge of the small boats crisis have been awarded a pay rise of 9%. Wonder how much they would have been awarded if they had actually done their job

BBC News - Nurses in England reject offer of 5.5% pay rise

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c7819kmz98vo

[exeterjeep]

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

More than happy to keep high interest rates. We got them under the Conservatives, so no point blaming anyone else.

[Kimbers]

I see Nurses have rejected a pay increase of 5.5%. Which is inflation, lets face it. Think Labour have made a rod for their own back now!

[C8RKH]

19 minutes ago, Kimbers said:

Which is inflation, lets face it.

Nope. Current inflation is 2.2%.

Can't blame the Nurses for wanting more when you see what the Junior Doctors got, 22% wasn't it?

This was always going to be the way. Can't believe Labour were stupid to think it would be any other way.

Nurses saying their pay has fallen 24% under the Conservatives since 2010, so guess that'll be what they are looking for.

So, the financial black hole will grow again. Labour will blame the Tories. Again. Inflation will increase due to the above inflation pay rises. Interest rates will stay high for mortgages. And so people will want another big pay rise next year. Labour will cave in and give it to them. Blame the Tories. And back around the Merry Go Round we go.

 

[PaulCP]

2 hours ago, C8RKH said:

Can't believe Labour were stupid to think it would be any other way.

Why would anyone expect a group of individuals who were totally ineffective in opposition to be effective when in government.

As for Reeves, she comes across more like a dictator than a member of the Labour cabinet. What they (Labour) have done so far is no different to Liz Truss with their jerk badly thought out decisions. The only difference is that the economy hasn’t crashed!

[C8RKH]

@PaulCP and the economy NOT crashing has nothing to do with Labour!

[Barrykearley]

15 hours ago, C8RKH said:

Nope. Current inflation is 2.2%.

Can't blame the Nurses for wanting more when you see what the Junior Doctors got, 22% wasn't it?

This was always going to be the way. Can't believe Labour were stupid to think it would be any other way.

Nurses saying their pay has fallen 24% under the Conservatives since 2010, so guess that'll be what they are looking for.

So, the financial black hole will grow again. Labour will blame the Tories. Again. Inflation will increase due to the above inflation pay rises. Interest rates will stay high for mortgages. And so people will want another big pay rise next year. Labour will cave in and give it to them. Blame the Tories. And back around the Merry Go Round we go.

 

It was amazing to listen to Lisa Nandy defending the cut to winter fuel payments. She was quick to say they have increased pensions with the triple lock and no one would loose out.

It really is about time that politicians become legally accountable for their misrepresentation and lies within public office. The black hole is largely something of labours own making - and it was absolutely no secret before and the Labour shadow opposition would have had full access to privileged access to all records. Their assertion that the OBR and the IFS had no idea really needs to be challenged 

[Chillidoggy]

It's comforting to know that Starmer will be behind us every step of the way during our "shared struggle."

[exeterjeep]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crejwrypryyo

Scrap law making schools serve meat, urges Labour donor

Major Labour donor Dale Vince says he wants to talk to the new government about scrapping compulsory meat and dairy in school meals in England.

The green entrepreneur, who has donated more than £5m to Labour, says vegan meals are healthier and better for the environment.

[Kimbers]

Maybe he could contribute to our shared struggle and pay back all those gifts he and his cabinet got! That money could go to a good cause!

1 minute ago, exeterjeep said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crejwrypryyo

Scrap law making schools serve meat, urges Labour donor

Major Labour donor Dale Vince says he wants to talk to the new government about scrapping compulsory meat and dairy in school meals in England.

The green entrepreneur, who has donated more than £5m to Labour, says vegan meals are healthier and better for the environment.

Don't get me started! You MUST adhere to my beliefs or I won't support you. Frankly I'd tell him where the door is!