Alunox 321 SS Manifold for Esprit Turbo Group Buy

[Jacques]

Strange, I Aldo have one of the later bracketry sets, but it does not look like yours.

I'll post a pic later today.

Cheers,

Jacques.

Edited September 26, 2015 by Jacques

[Chillidoggy]

Maybe this might help, Mikie -

 

[MikieP]

Mine looks nothing like this at all. I paid 80GBP and got what I showed in my pic and no one can figure out how it goes on so back on only one like the initial push from Alunox. Guess I need to query ALunox yet again.

[Chillidoggy]

As I said before, that was what was supplied with my manifold, which was in the last and latest group buy. Yes, I suggest you get in touch with Alunox.

That said, perhaps you may wish to revisit all the correspondence and controversy on TLF surrounding it. Personally, I remain unconvinced that the bracket is strictly necessary, I only fitted it because it was supplied, so there you go.

[MikieP]

Ian,

Not sure but think I got the first issued manifold after Mark got his.

Alunox message sent just now. Most comments suggest its use if heavier turbo installed though weight support is not its purpose so thoroughly confused on why it was even provided. Apparently most original issues broke so there is some purpose for it...  Much thanks, Ian and Jacques. Off to bed for now.

Edited September 26, 2015 by MikieP

[Chillidoggy]

Ian,

 

Alunox message sent just now. Most comments suggest its use if heavier turbo installed though weight support is not its purpose so thoroughly confused on why it was even provided. Apparently most original issues broke so there is some purpose for it...  Much thanks.

I'd PM Dave Lisle on here (CHANGES) if I were you. He knows what he's talking about: He designed the manifold.

[Vulcan Grey]

These were the parts (blots and nuts not shown) supplied to me by Alunox after the first broken bracket was reported. There was one bracket and two of the turnbuckle things, one of which is again now somewhere in the car. Latest shop could not figure out where the rest of these parts went... Any ideas?

It looks like that one might go on like this?

http://www.thelotusforums.com/forums/topic/61738-alunox-321-ss-manifold-for-esprit-turbo-group-buy/?do=findComment&comment=529421

 

 

[CHANGES]

Ian,

Not sure but think I got the first issued manifold after Mark got his.

Alunox message sent just now. Most comments suggest its use if heavier turbo installed though weight support is not its purpose so thoroughly confused on why it was even provided. Apparently most original issues broke so there is some purpose for it...  Much thanks, Ian and Jacques. Off to bed for now.

After a couple of brackets failed an initial panic situation was created about them and the effects on the manifold by someone who had a strong but unqualified opinion. That person did not own or have any first hand experience with the design set up but was adamant in his opinion.  Unfortunately the result was all sorts of rumors were started.                  To reassure the customers alternative designs of brackets were manufactured and made available by Alunox to counter any doubts they may have.. ( as shown in posts previous ) 

I have the original bracket format fitted as designed, which has undertaken far more expansion/contraction stresses than those which failed. This creates some confusion as to why, the only logical answer being initial fitted tension causing excessive flex on the brackets leading to failure. I believe new brackets have addressed the flexing parameters which should prevent a recurrence.  This does not mean they should be fitted willy nilly , you should still insure there is no tension on the turn buckles when in the relaxed state after several temperature cycles.

NB   The brackets are not to support the weight of any turbo they are a secondary stabilizing device only.

I would have no issue without it being fitted at all .. I recently worked on an engine fitted with Alunox manifold where the bracket failed thousands of miles ago but not replaced. This is an engine that is driven hard by its owner so subject to more extreme expansion flexing.  I took the opportunity to inspect the manifold during removal and refit. I found no signs of any fatigue that would concern me.  I also did a detailed inspection on my own manifold recently and considering the abuse I give it I was quietly impressed.  The 1200' wrapping I used did not fair as well, it had fallen to pieces. The manufactures said it had to have gone regularly over temp limit to do that. I refitted 1800' wrapping this time.  These are examples of how the more extreme tests with these manifolds are fairing.

The design format of this manifold is that it should be able to flex and slip within the primary to collector joints during expansion. The bracket was designed not restrict this movement and should be fitted accordingly.. 

The primary support of the secondary / collector section of the manifold is the turbo which has no weight bearing issues, it is self supporting within its own semi flexible mounts.  Contrary to the rumors the turbo acts as a mounting platform for the manifold.   The bracket is secondary.   This does mean your turbo / exhaust and charge cooler supports should be in good order.   

Hopefully this has helped clear a few questions..    

My contribution to this manifold has been voluntary,  My design input and the development testing is as an independent, The performance results and information I have volunteered on this forum have NO financial influence.                   

   

[MarkKassim]

Hi Mike,

             Just adding to what Dave as said, yes the bracket does't support the turbo but protects the manifold from Shock Loading. If you were to hit a bump in the road , the turbo could create a force up and down due to its weight. The brace acts as a safety net ,but as Dave says the top hose to the Turbo also provides this.

The standard single brace is intended for use with the standard turbo. 

The dual brace is intended for use with larger turbos which have a larger mass to give even greater protection from shock loading.

Both provide extra protection, giving piece of mind to owners investing in this product. It could be debated is it required due to good design of manifold. Alunox supply the brace because race teams use them. This manifold has been produced to the same standard.

Mark

[Jay Gallentine]

Hello Everyone,

Just a quick follow-up from me... today I installed the replacement bracket for the Alunox manifold. It fit perfectly and only took a couple of hours to do, including putting the car's back end up onto jack stands.

Extreme kudos to the folks who have worked with Alunox to get this done. It's top-quality equipment and I can't thank you guys enough!

I will attach two pictures - one of my original bracket (which broke), and one of the replacement bracket installed. 

I'm fairly convinced that my original bracket broke because we installed it rather tightly and there was just no give in it.

Regards to All,
Jay Gallentine

Shorewood, Minnesota, USA

[CarlC]

I'll stick a note in the for sale section, but having now sadly written off my car   before fitting my Alunox manifold, I now have one for sale. This was purchased as part of the second group by You'll see my name on the list and is still in the original Alunox box it was shipped to me in. Please message me if interested in purchasing. 

[Kevin Wheeler]

What happened to the car, Carl?

Nobody hurt, I hope.

[Loose Cannon]

I've messaged you about the manifold Carl. Terrible circumstances though for a long term owner like yourself.

[Jacques]

Hello all,

I am about to fit this set, so I'd like to know where to install the brackets, not to stress anything etc. And maybe some picutes of the best possible installation.

Thanks you in advance.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[Sparky]

Hi Jacques.  The last photo on this page should give you what you need.  The bracket should be fitted under neutral load.  My personal opinion is to run it without the bracket and let things settle with a few good heat cycles before fitting it.

[Jacques]

Hello Sparky, Thanks, taht makes sense. I will get to that, but today, when I am lining up the manifold to the cast one, I adjust a Little on some of the tubes, after having sprayed their couplings, and no. 3 does not align, I tried to twist it, and it's really really hard. So, I took it all off, and tried twisting the others, but to no help, they won't align with no.3. I tried to spray all tubes a few times, adn twisting them to get them moving, and some will move a bit, mostly no 1. I spent a couple of hours doing that. Now I bolted them back on to the cast manifold, and easy peasy no. 1, 2 an 4 align.

It's not like I can just pull no. 3 a bit more out, and then the other three out some more, for example. And it also prevents the rurbo from sitting stressfree.

You know, I am not a mechanic, but willing to try most Things, and usually succeed in doing so, albeit very very slowly, ha ha. But these tubes surely are a tight fit. I can move no. 3 slightly, but not forth and back, and only under grear pressure.

I've now sprayed them liberally with wd40 and let then stay upright, so it may run Down and free it up a bit more. I' go get some sliding spray from another garage for later.

I need to bring back no. 3 a bit and then maybe twist it to align with the others. any good ideas on that too? I'll post a few pics when I get back.

btw. no. 3 is counting as if it was installed on the engine, so would be cylinder 3.

Jacques.

[Jacques]

Here's a couple of pics to demonstrate what I mean:

So far, I've tried force, heat, and NeXT I may make a system with Winding up some tough metal wires to force the tube on a bit more. Good ideas are most wellcome!!!

It is for example a good idea to take it all apart and Work a bit on the metal surfaces to make them slip better? Or would it only make them not seal propperly?

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[Sparky]

Mine was exactly the same.  I got cyl 4 on and spun on nuts 2 or 3 turns, then levered the thing until it popped over.  As long as you're careful with the studs, you should be OK.  Ian had the same with his.  It just needs a bit of careful brute force.

[Chillidoggy]

Yes, I had a similar experience. Don't take the primaries out of the collector, though.

I got the flanges as lined up as I could off the engine first. Starting at No.1, I slip the flange on and put as many plain nuts as you can manage on it. Then, as Sparky says, you can get in there with a pry-bar, or crowbar, and 'persuade' the next flange to line up, put the plain nuts on, then the next etc. Eventually you'll have it lined up. Then you can remove the plain nuts and fit whatever locking nuts you choose.

 

Oh, and congratulations on getting the old one off in situ!

[ramjet]

Merged.  

[Loose Cannon]

A timely post Jacques, just about to start this job too. Somehow I thought it would be easier, should have known.

[Jacques]

"We can do this the easy way, or we can do this the rough way" Tina said. Well, nothing seems to be the easy way, does it now?

I am trying to get everything lined up before installing it onto the engine, so therefore I am still open to suggestions. I will try with a heating gun and a special Cold spray.

Kind regards,

Jacques.

[Chillidoggy]

Try and bolt it up to the manifold first. Back to back.

Start at No.1, with plain bolts that are the largest size you can get through the holes. Then knock it the next flange gently with a copper/hide mallet until you get it in line, then bolt that up, then do the same for the others before you offer it up to the cylinder head.

Unless your old cast iron manifold is warped?

[Sparky]

IMHO you're flogging a dead horse trying to align it before it goes on.

[v39]

I fitted Alunox manifold in situ on my S4S

I located first pipe then with 1inch webbing strap around adjacent pipe twisted it to pull it over studs.

Hope this makes sense.