The Donald.

[snowrx]

Looping back to the forums, it appears that Kamala is Sanskrit for "Lotus".   President Lotus in our future?  Lighter and simpler politician?

[Bibs]

Says it like it is. Bring this man back! 

[C8RKH]

Yup, but be honest now. What did he actually achieve? What change did he really make? What lasting legacy has he left?  Great guy. Decent man. Good President. But truly effective? Hmmm.

Obviously better than Trump in all ways. But how will history recall his legacy?

[comem47]

FDR was the only 3 term  president before it was limited to 2 terms. Of course like Putin, Trump would like to make himself permanent.I'd like to see an amendment outlawing bozos or reality TV personalities from running. (absolutely no qualifications or practical experience on Trumps part)

Edited August 20, 2020 by comem47

[C8RKH]

56 minutes ago, comem47 said:

(absolutely no qualifications or practical experience on Trumps part

And in reality how does that make him any different than most of the presidential candidates for the last 30 years?  There have been many who were not qualified for the role (and actually, what makes a good qualification criteria for the "leader of the free world"?) and the best "grew" into the role, and the worst, didn't get re-elected for the 2nd term.

I think a lot of double standards get shown in these discussions and it is driven largely by prejudice, even if it is in the subconscious.  

Don't get me wrong. I don't think Trump has been a good President overall. However, if you think back a few years ago his message was simple and clear and he meant it - My first priority as President will be to Americans - America for the Americans - was essentially his mantra. He's gone about it like a crazed bull in a China shop, but the sentiment of his "fix the problems at home and keep the investment in America" approach still has many many followers in the old, decimated, industrial blue collar areas of the good ol' USofA.

[comem47]

Rather than filling his cabinet with well qualified people to consult, Trump seemed to put family and friends first and shuns expert advice input. Essentially all the eggs are in the one Trump basket. He has not learned on the job because he only listens to himself. A good president should seek out best qualified candidates in the respective area of expertise. They all seem to have no qualifications. 

The blind not listening to the blind. Anyone was a better president than Trump.

[C8RKH]

Hilary may have been a better groomed candidate but not sure the USA would be in a better position for having her!  She may have not been as "subtle as Trump" about it but Hilary struck me as a woman on a mission with a big open mouth and closed ears!  

Again, don't confuse my posts with those of a rabid Trump fan. I can see why he won. His messaging was strong and resonated. Early on you could argue he deliberately shunned career politicians and advisors in his circle to shake the tree. Unfortunately at some point around the end of the first year he was shaking the tree so hard it seemed like he had either rattle frazzled his brain or it clean fell out through his ears. And that's the Trump we have now!

[comem47]

I am certainly no Hillary fan, but from the beginning Trump was in it for himself. Traditionally past Presidents knew how government worked having previously been a member of the Senate, House, Governor, etc.  He has no feel the responsibilities and sensitivity of international situations. He often flips his opinion several times (to try to appease the crowd he's playing to at the time, be it racists or whomever) rather than measure 3 times and cut once. A real loose cannon. Lie, counter-lie and then lie again.

He's made a worse swamp than existed previously. He won't listen to Fauci, but rather push his own snake oil cure for Covid (his fiends likely have stock)

He's not a doctor, has no military experience (evaded draft) and he doesn't make money the traditional way, but through bankruptcies (which we the taxpayers pay for). A legend in his own mind. He still is fighting disclosing his previous tax returns, unlike all the other candidates. (it will expose the crook he is) Don't forget he was impeached, just wasn't removed from office because his party is the senate majority.

 

Edited August 20, 2020 by comem47

[C8RKH]

Bill Clinton was impeached and not removed too if I recall correctly due to a different woman with a wide open mouth. He lied about it of course!

Just playing with you but don't throw stones that others have tarred too to make it sound like Trump was / is unique in his behaviours.

Didn't Nixon lie over Watergate? Bush over WMDs that cost a lot of people their lives?

Trump is an appalling Statesman for sure. But not the first President to be impeached. Not the first to be found lying. Not the first to feather his nest etc....

He's much worse but only guilty of what many before him have done surely?

In my view these days people only choose to go into Politics for themselves. Clinton and Obama's financial net worth post Presidency is significantly enhanced from the pre state is it not? Ask not what your country can do for you, but what leading your country can do for your bank balance!

We've got the same here with Blair, Cameron et al.

[comem47]

Trump: The gift that keeps on giving  😜

https://www.chicagotribune.com/columns/rex-huppke/ct-steve-bannon-arrest-trump-fraud-wall-charged-build-scam-huppke-20200820-ukrvw536cza4jmgxoqkvkjfwpi-story.html

[snowrx]

Unfortunately, most of the Donors and Lobbyists he's put in charge of our country are never going to be held to account for their actions, and we'll see them again in the coming years.

I don't envy Mr. Biden should he win, as he will face the same well-tuned obstructionist opposition Obama could not overcome, and will have to undo a lot of damage with a GOP-stripped revenue base further damaged by the Covid economy.  It would take tremendous effort and a good bit of luck just to get halfway back to normal.  

We're no longer even #1 in new Covid cases,  India has pushed us aside and may soon overtake us in total cases.  (muted cries of America first!,USA! USA!,) 

[C8RKH]

A fine example right here how "soundbites" (which unfortunately seems to be how our whole news system now works as opposed to proper, investigative journalism" can easily be used to push a perception. On reading the below you'd first think that Trump was lauding the far right/neo Nazi's as "fine people", but then further down you find out that he actually "dismissed them" directly.  I just find interesting how the "politics" of today works and how twitter (I hate that fcuking system) has done a lot to actually kill proper freedom of speech as it is now all about soundbites over true substance.

 

Claim 3: President Trump said there were "very fine people on both sides", when asked about a far-right rally in 2017.

Mr Biden said one of his goals would be to "wipe out the stain of racism" and he recalled the far-right protests in Charlottesville, Virginia in 2017 which led to violent clashes and left one counter-protester dead.

He said: "Remember what the President said when asked, he said there were, quote, very fine people on both sides".

Mr Biden said that after this moment "I knew I had to run" for president.

According to a transcript of a press conference on 15 August, President Trump did say - when asked about the presence of neo-Nazis at the rally - "you had some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides."

During the same press conference, Mr Trump went on to say "I'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally."

[mg4lotus]

Treat all sources of data with the suspicion they deserve

[Neal H]

Is there an unbiased news source left that doesn’t have an agenda? I grew up believing that the BBC was such a source, but clearly at some point that changed.

Any BBC headline about Trump is negative and derogatory, while any headline about Biden is positive and upbeat, much the same as their Brexit reporting.

[mayevora]

[Bibs]

Say what?

 

[Loquacious Lew]

I'm surprised....no shocked(!)....that nobody has brought up Trump's delicate condition yet.  Probably our time differences.  In the event the news hasn't yet made it your way, Trump is in hospital, Walter Reed Medical Center to be precise, with CV-19.  Speculation, as you can imagine, is running rampant.  I have my own notions. 

Melania has a dose too.  Many in the administration are testing positive. 

I suspect Trump's is at least a moderately severe case. He hasn't tweeted for almost 17 hours which was when he tweeted that he had contracted Covid 119.  By the way, that tweet got the most likes ever on his feed. I think about 1.75 million so far. Feel free to discuss meanings and ramifications, if any.  We're all doing that over here.  

[snowrx]

Well , I guess that is worth logging my deceased cat into his twitter account for the third time, he'll be liking that post for sure.

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

What do the voters make of his tax avoidance? His illness seems to have knocked that off the front pages. I read he has paid $750 dollars in each of two recent years and f**k all in the others. He bangs on about Making America Great and supporting the Armed Forces, yet his own personal financial contribution to the cause is practically zero. The spotty teenager flipping burgers in McDonald’s probably pays more tax than he does. That’s incredibly greedy and unpatriotic.

[march]

This is an interesting watch whatever your views.

 

[Loquacious Lew]

5 hours ago, LotusLeftLotusRight said:

What do the voters make of his tax avoidance? His illness seems to have knocked that off the front pages. I read he has paid $750 dollars in each of two recent years and f**k all in the others. He bangs on about Making America Great and supporting the Armed Forces, yet his own personal financial contribution to the cause is practically zero. The spotty teenager flipping burgers in McDonald’s probably pays more tax than he does. That’s incredibly greedy and unpatriotic.

This news further polarizes opinion, I'm sure.  I only know what I think....no surprises here, the man is criminally irresponsible and willing to break all moral and ethical rules to his own benefit..  He games everything and everyone, putting his greed on display for all to see.  The tax scandal is but one more straw that will be ignored by his sycophants but adds weight to the case against him.  I can assure you it won't be ignored if the government changes hands in November.  

The notion that all our leaders have always been as dishonest and  incompetent as Trump has proven to be is simply not true.   Obama was prepared for the job, Mrs. Clinton would surely have been equally facile or at least  far, far better qualified than Trump has been for handling many of our issues, including the response to the epidemic.  Trump and his minion's  lack of familiarity with basic scientific principles (and more, their malicious willingness to throw science under the bus)  is but the start of their (Trump's people) differences in capabilities.  Then there is their greed, avarice, and general disregard for the  human consequences of any decisions they make that don't affect them directly or might cost them  power and money at a personal level.  This year the differences between our choices have become ever plainer to see.   Democrats will  do a better job filling all the positions of authority that any  effective government depends on.  Republicans as a whole have failed to operate in the best interests of this country.  They have gutted our institutions and pandered to our worst instincts.   

The notion that our leaders, their philosophies and their actions  (and the integrity of our various news outlets) are all the same is simply wrong.  One might ponder that the Beeb's (and all but Fox News' and their imitators) panning of Trump is warranted because he has earned nothing but contempt.  Now his own pig headedness and pointless politicization of everything starting with our response to this disease is coming home to roost. 

[comem47]

Trump is all about Trump and family. Period.

That so called debate was his opportunity to kick sand in Biden's face and get in a sucker punch first. A coward bully, I still can't believe people think he's a financial genius. He knows how to milk the public through bankruptcies (no building) We all pay into his coffers.

[mg4lotus]

We are probably not commenting as we are waiting to definitively find out if he really has it or is he just pretending. How seriously he has it. Will he live or will he die.

[C8RKH]

Or maybe it's because basically we just don't care! 

However, Mr. Obama was prepared for it. Hmm, shame he really didn't deliver anything of real substance.

Hilary - ha please don't make me laugh. You demonise Trump for being all about him then throw Clinton in!  Lol. Laughed my ass off.

I think the main issue is that in the US, as here in the UK, there is a void in decency and social conscious in our senior political leaders. Is part of a wider "me one" trend where people put their desire for celebrity, self promotion and self gain first.  

It's an endemic that is ripping the UK/US to pieces and creating generations of entitled snowflakes.

So in that context Trumps antics really are nothing other but a distraction at best, a damning reflection of what society is becoming at worst.

[Techyd]

I'm pretty sure that Obama's loss in terms of not achieving 'much' is more attributed to the broken american political system resulting from the two party system that they have; he couldn't get anything past the republicans. 

Frankly, with the party divisions so far weighted to the extremes on either side, it seems to me that America might actually still be in a civil war; they just don't know it!  When it comes to voting, what they need to get on top of are the 'single reason' voters.

6 hours ago, C8RKH said:

It's an endemic that is ripping the UK/US to pieces and creating generations of entitled snowflakes.

I think you're absolutely right, the legacy Trump has already established that the needs of the one (him) outweigh the needs of the many, and he's done that within the political system so America will now proceed forth with 'personalities' as their president, rather than diplomatic, rational and level headed, which I maintain that Obama was; despite his achievements not 'measuring up'.

Of course - I'm also sure what I am exposed to here in the UK through the various news channels is severely bias to whatever the news is wishing for me to see, so what I do know?!! haha