Smart meters

[oneshot]

So I have a smart meter in my house on the electricity (gas is tanked LPG). The company I was with (British Gas) used to read the meter remotely. Having now changed contract and got a better deal I have switched to Eon. Unfortunately Eon cannot read the smart meter and cannot install a new one as we already have one!

Apparently there is currently no standard for smart meters so companies install their own and then other companies cannot read it. I am not sure this is what the Government intended when they rolled out the smart meter programme.

[Barrykearley]

Doh.......

sounds like joined up thinking that !!

[andydclements]

I'm wondering why we'd be surprised by this.

[calvan]

Apparently if the meter is smart, no-one else at the electric company has to be. It shows. 

[march]

On 7/27/2016 at 00:21, calvan said:

Apparently if the meter is smart, no-one else at the electric company has to be. It shows. 

What happens when the smart meter is not so smart. Well we have had our first bill since having the Smart meter fitted - apparently the smart meter is sulking and doesn't want to talk to the supplier, it also sulks with us periodically and won't even tell us how much electricity we are using! So we get a whacking great estimated bill - not impressed EDF. 

And they are going to build the next nuclear power station - glad I don't live near Hinckley

Thinking of calling our smart meter HAL.

[C8RKH]

On 26/07/2016 at 12:45, oneshot said:

Apparently there is currently no standard for smart meters so companies install their own and then other companies cannot read it. I am not sure this is what the Government intended when they rolled out the smart meter programme.

This is not correct. The first standard for smart meters in the UK was SMETS, we now have SMETS2, and all meters need to be certified to the standards before they can be used. The Government, more specifically, Ofgem and DECC have completed screwed up the whole roll-out which is now around 6 years behind target and with yearly escalating costs. To be fair, the energy companies are trying to roll-out the best they can to give customers the functionally promised, but Ofgem, DECC and the Government continue to screw it up on a quarterly basis.

In just about every country in Europe, the meter is "owned" by the distribution company - the company responsible for transporting the energy through the wires - but oh no, in the UK we have to be different so your supplier owns the meter. So logically, how does this work when you switch supplier? Do you need a new meter? Hahahaha, what a l;augh that would be. No, your new supplier needs to take on the meter (specc'ed by the original supplier) and integrate it into their IT systems. Bloody total lunacy. We can thank a certain Ed Miliband for a lot of this lunacy from when he was energy minister.

To be clear, smart meters will connect to a central governing body call the DCC who will act as a hub to gather all of the readings. They will then aggregate them and pass them out to your supplier who will then be able to access the data and calculate your energy usage etc. There will likely be a 24 delay in the energy company receiving the data due to this "central body" being put in the way. I believe most people "think" that there smart meter will be connected to British Gas, Ovo, EdF, etc. Well, you'd be wrong!

Oh, and despite currently being very late, the company that the Government awarded the DCC contract too, is late in delivering their central platform. Another 6 month delay with knock on costs to the energy companies that they are just expected to swallow up. That company who runs the DCC, Capita. Need I say more? I was at an industry conference 6 months or so after the DCC company was setup - a charming presentation from a charming lady from that company focused on - the opportunities for the energy companies to buy all these lovely additional data related services from, you guessed it, the DCC. It's just such a shame they were not putting the same effort into actually delivering the core bloody service they are being paid a lot of money to deliver!

Typical UK government cack handed response were we also lost the opportunity to take around 6,000 school levers and out them through a national certification process for electricity and gas installation and provide them with a guaranteed 5-7 years of work to get them on their way. F@cking marvelous total screw up that is going to cost every energy consumer around £500 each over the first 5 or so years. Brainless morons the lot of them and they would not listen to the "experts" in the utility companies who tried to warn them.

20 minutes ago, march said:

And they are going to build the next nuclear power station - glad I don't live near Hinckley

 

No that will be the same people as built the majority of the US railways in the 1800's - the Chinese!

[march]

Just had to get on to EDF about our smart meter not working at all and have just been told 80-90,000 people are affected as they were unable to cope with the clocks changing! What makes things worse is that the fix is being transmitted over the mobile network and we have no mobile reception where the meter is!. The chap had no answer to that! Oh well one completely useless smart meter.

[C8RKH]

Please do not blame your electricity supplier for this. The blame lies squarely with the previous Labour Government, Camerons Govt, Ofgem and DECC who have royally screwed this up. Closely followed by the EU who mandated smart meter rollout regardless of cost or other impacts by 2020.

Also they have their own dedicated network which is run seperately to the Telco networks. That was an Ofgem/DECC decision.

[Chillidoggy]

Always makes me wonder how much power it takes to drive all those wheels spinning round in my meter.

[oilmagnet477]

Reading today that 2nd generation smart meters are now being fitted.  1st gen ones should no longer be offered (but you need to specify if having one fitted!)

I simply do not understand the point of this govt initiative? In the paper, the cost of this plan if rolled out Nationwide runs into several BILLION £ (can't remember specifics)

Average annual saving is claimed to be £30 per household but 'real life' figures claim nearer £11/pa with some claiming that consumption has actually increased.

I don't need a smart meter to tell me that my wife and f**king kids are completely incapable of turning off a light/tv/music when leaving a room. Also it appears that the meters themselves consume electricity.

Genuine question - has ANYONE IN ANY GOVERNMENT EVER done anything that makes sense?

[Advantage]

As above, I do struggle to understand the thinking behind them. Surely people know if all the lights in the house are on or if there's a TV blaring in every room? 

But more importantly, what's in it for the suppliers? They won't be doing this in exchange for nothing, so what do they get out of all these installations? 

[Barrykearley]

The ability to charge you different rates in the future.

wont be long and you will be paying a fortune for electric between 5pm and 11pm 

[Colin P]

I think the key thing for govt was to try and fix the debacle of estimated readings. At one stage like many others I never really checked (I do now) and ended up with First Utility owing me nearly £1500. Took me nearly 3 months to get it back from them. Amazing that they can take a debit card payment immediately but cannot credit back a balance without it going through their payment system, which only runs once a fortnight.

I now have an argument every 6 months when they try and stick up the monthly payments.....No smart meter for us - as there is no mobile signal.

[Advantage]

Technology, you say? Machines, they're full of kids.

 

[oilmagnet477]

1 hour ago, Colin P said:

I think the key thing for govt was to try and fix the debacle of estimated readings

Given that virtually everything is done online these days, why the need for estimated readings anymore - if that is the reasoning behind this then surely (and unsurprisingly!) Govt is behind the curve?

I send a meter reading every time a bill is due - if this needs to be validated the supplier still sends someone out but I could just as easily send a photo with the reading and the Meter ID number.

Not really rocket science is it and it costs nothing.

Like you, we also live in an area with crap broadband and mobile coverage - surely the billions spent on this daft project could have been used to focus tech delivery in rural areas (AKA the forgotten lands).

@Buddsy, I assume from now on you will be sending anything you want 'posted' on here directly to @Bibs using snail mail so that he can use technology to post it for you? 😋

[Colin P]

What, you use Virgin media too? 

[Chillidoggy]

Not long had Virgin Media dig up my road and path. How good/bad is it?

[Techyd]

I think its the connection back to the supplier with the readings that's the issue rather than the compliance / 'standardness' of the device itself.

[C8RKH]

It was the fooking EU. No. Not another rant.  This all started about 12 years ago. The EU decided that all countries needed to install smart meters. It was passed as an EU rule into law and the target was for all homes to have a smart meter installed by 2020. If the Government had not have done it the UK would have been subjected to heavy EU fines.

It's not an iniative from your energy supplier. It has cost them each hundreds of millions (the big 6) and has been a right royal pain in the arse for them 

The cost of smart meters and the rollout is being fully passed on to consumers through a levy on their bill.

It's been a fooking shambles.

[Colin P]

1 hour ago, Chillidoggy said:

Not long had Virgin Media dig up my road and path. How good/bad is it?

At the moment it seems to be OK, but I've had repeated issues issues in the past where they have clearly done things that affect service because they have over subscribed the system. Things will get slower and slower until you run a speedchecker, then all of a sudden things are good for a week or so. Coincidence - make your own mind up, I have. Combine that with the constant attempts to increase prices they are just a pain, but then again I hear the same stories about all the other suppliers - I was attempting humor more than anything, although equally don't feel guilty/feel justified about using them as the butt of the joke.

[oilmagnet477]

https://ses.jrc.ec.europa.eu/smart-metering-deployment-european-union

Interesting read - you could draw from this that it is NOT compulsory - for example, Germany are only expecting a 23% rollout by 2020 (compared to the UK target of 100%!) as they are doing a 'Selective rollout'.

It is also subject to a cost-benefit-analysis.

Well, I checked the newspaper article and allowing for the fact that it was in the Telegraph, they reckon the UK cost to be £11bn!! I wonder if they have their facts wrong (surely not?) and that is 11Bn Euros across the 27 member states.

If the £11bn is UK wide, then, assuming 30 million domestic homes, it is costing £367/home to install. At a 'real' savings rate of £11/pa - is a 30yr pay back ever going to be a successful CBA outcome?

Surely that money would be much better spent on retrofitting all existing housing stock with insulation or other energy saving mechanisms - some have been done I know but our 1650's timbered farmhouse was excluded so anything that has been done has been done by yours truly.

[C8RKH]

Selective reading @oilmagnet477 at its best!

[Dan.G]

On 04/08/2016 at 20:50, C8RKH said:

This is not correct. The first standard for smart meters in the UK was SMETS, we now have SMETS2, and all meters need to be certified to the standards before they can be used. The Government, more specifically, Ofgem and DECC have completed screwed up the whole roll-out which is now around 6 years behind target and with yearly escalating costs. To be fair, the energy companies are trying to roll-out the best they can to give customers the functionally promised, but Ofgem, DECC and the Government continue to screw it up on a quarterly basis.

In just about every country in Europe, the meter is "owned" by the distribution company - the company responsible for transporting the energy through the wires - but oh no, in the UK we have to be different so your supplier owns the meter. So logically, how does this work when you switch supplier? Do you need a new meter? Hahahaha, what a l;augh that would be. No, your new supplier needs to take on the meter (specc'ed by the original supplier) and integrate it into their IT systems. Bloody total lunacy. We can thank a certain Ed Miliband for a lot of this lunacy from when he was energy minister.

To be clear, smart meters will connect to a central governing body call the DCC who will act as a hub to gather all of the readings. They will then aggregate them and pass them out to your supplier who will then be able to access the data and calculate your energy usage etc. There will likely be a 24 delay in the energy company receiving the data due to this "central body" being put in the way. I believe most people "think" that there smart meter will be connected to British Gas, Ovo, EdF, etc. Well, you'd be wrong!

Oh, and despite currently being very late, the company that the Government awarded the DCC contract too, is late in delivering their central platform. Another 6 month delay with knock on costs to the energy companies that they are just expected to swallow up. That company who runs the DCC, Capita. Need I say more? I was at an industry conference 6 months or so after the DCC company was setup - a charming presentation from a charming lady from that company focused on - the opportunities for the energy companies to buy all these lovely additional data related services from, you guessed it, the DCC. It's just such a shame they were not putting the same effort into actually delivering the core bloody service they are being paid a lot of money to deliver!

Typical UK government cack handed response were we also lost the opportunity to take around 6,000 school levers and out them through a national certification process for electricity and gas installation and provide them with a guaranteed 5-7 years of work to get them on their way. F@cking marvelous total screw up that is going to cost every energy consumer around £500 each over the first 5 or so years. Brainless morons the lot of them and they would not listen to the "experts" in the utility companies who tried to warn them.

No that will be the same people as built the majority of the US railways in the 1800's - the Chinese!

Someone clearly works in the industry...

The above comments are correct

[C8RKH]

Afraid not @Dan.G. I work for an IT company for my sins 

[Barrykearley]

Oh look

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62626908

On 18/03/2019 at 07:01, Barrykearley said:

The ability to charge you different rates in the future.

wont be long and you will be paying a fortune for electric between 5pm and 11pm 

just as I predicted