Future of Lotus

[NedaSay]

5 hours ago, mdavies said:

No comment yet from the heavyweights here?  Re Popham's quote in the March EVO (271), p39 re the new range:

"..........appeal to a much larger audience tomorrow. And electrification will be key to this. Lotus will offer a level of electrification on all future cars and it's our learnings from Evija that will allow us to do this."   (No mis-typing: "Evija," not "the Evija". Better get on message everybody, it's a whole mind-set.)

But, more significantly, I'm taking "all future cars" to include the forthcoming Evora chassis sports car.

So saving for my 430 redoubled.

  

 

Electrification may mean adding a 48v battery to transform the car in a mild hybrid with very little in terms of weight penalty that cannot be offset by using cast alloy and more aluminium panels elsewhere... it may mean package protection on the new car to fit a full EV package on the car... bear in mind Lotus has already package protected the Evora some  years ago 414E will probably ring a bell with some here. With technological progress, the packaging of batteries would allow for a trunk today... Electrification may also mean a modern loom with a full electric pack with god forbid electric seats, electric steering column, simulated gearshifting, auto start stop, lidar, ADASS level 3... The lot... And yes Lotus has been on hiring spree to fill position on all these key areas.

[KAS-118]

I also thought the “stop-gap’ car was going to be petrol - but anything after that was EV.

However, who knows for sure until it comes out - at one stage the ‘next car’ was going to be an SUV but I believe that’s been taken off the table.

[electro_boy]

I think we are a little way off from full EV sports cars for the mid to high end market, ie not a hypercar.  Battery density is not quite enough and when you start pushing the go faster pedal the range starts to drop dramatically.  But sure I recon a hybrid for the next gen cars is possible.

As far as I understand Pophams comments regarding the SUV is that focus is on sports cars.   So maybe not off the table maybe more on the back burner?

Personally I think the SUV fad will have gone by the time Lotus get on the bandwagon so they might as well forget about it and concentrate on the sports cars please.

[KAS-118]

5 hours ago, electro_boy said:

Personally I think the SUV fad will have gone by the time Lotus get on the bandwagon so they might as well forget about it and concentrate on the sports cars please.

I tend to agree about the SUV, I think the time that it would be of benefit to Lotus has now passed.

I think they do need to produce a 'proper" 2+2 - but you could probably do that in an Evora sized EV as you can lose the engine, fuel tank and gearbox. 

I seem to recall seeing an article where Popham didn't seem so enthusiastic about hybrids?

Edit: but then again he mentions them here https://www.cityam.com/what-does-the-future-hold-for-lotus-ceo-phil-popham-on-the-classic-marques-direction/

Edited February 18, 2020 by KAS-118

[The Pits]

Full electric SUV (SUEV?) probably has a future but agree that fast petrol has a short sell-by date.

[PAR]

Hybrid is such a compromised technical choice that it would be an odd choice for a lotus sports car. Only explainable of we are think SUV or something like that.

Lotus volume should have them ok to have the next car being petrol only then they can consider merging it in the rest of the geely group if they go all electric after that.

Lotus cars donc need to be that practical so much easier to make a pure technical choice like all ev. Curious to see if they matais the Evija battery implementation choice (rather than skateboard platform of others)

[Bibs]

On 17/02/2020 at 22:53, Likuid said:

I swear I read or heard somewhere that the "stop gap" car will be petrol only.

They'll probably use gamma rays #cuttingedge

[NedaSay]

The SUV or high riding crossover does make sense, it make even more sense if you make it an EV...  the Lotus ESUV development may take place in a remote location and we will probably only see it when they are good and ready to go with the validation engineering prototype. That ESUV alone can prop the company into the 10,000 vehicle sold range while staying in the same price bracket has the vehicle on sale today. 

[TheKevlarKid]

7 hours ago, PAR said:

Hybrid is such a compromised technical choice that it would be an odd choice for a lotus sports car. Only explainable of we are think SUV or something like that.

Lotus volume should have them ok to have the next car being petrol only then they can consider merging it in the rest of the geely group if they go all electric after that.

Lotus cars donc need to be that practical so much easier to make a pure technical choice like all ev. Curious to see if they matais the Evija battery implementation choice (rather than skateboard platform of others)

The new nsx has failed pretty badly at going hybrid. High expense, low sales.

As for practicality,  the new car has to have better features as a daily driver than that of the old ones. That's one of Lotus main problems, people generally buy them as a third or forth car that are for special occasions and limited use. They need to do much better numbers on this one and get people in them as a 'daily driver' else Geely are wasting their time.

6 hours ago, Bibs said:

They'll probably use gamma rays #cuttingedge

Turns green when angry?

Edited February 19, 2020 by TheKevlarKid

[C8RKH]

7 hours ago, Bibs said:

They'll probably use gamma rays #cuttingedge

I had heard they had bought an old Enterprise and where canabalising the dilithium crystals for the S3 Evora Warp. Gavin Kershaw was last seen driving round the Hethel track screaming "I cannae tak' it any more Popham...."

[Sport220]

Out of curiosity, haven't heard of these https://media.lotuscars.com/en/news-articles/lotus-unveils-grand-design-for-new-customer-experience-centre,-heritage-centre-and-museum-at-hethel.html# since the 70th celebrations.

Has construction begun yet?

[Bibs]

It most certainly has. I'm sure we'll hear more about them once they're done, but understandably, Lotus aren't releasing building site shots.

[scotty435]

Thanks Bibs for the update,  me for one after watching the latest press release this week of the Evija it looks like things are definitely happening now at Hethel and I can not wait for what Lotus are going to bring to the table this year.

[NedaSay]

I'm curious as to whether the new factory - atelier really - is a refurbished part of factory 2 or is housed in the " DB skeleton" that Lotus has been working for a little while now.

[mdavies]

Was I hallucinating?  At Sainsbury's magazine shelves? The new Autocar?  Cover and major feature on the new Esprit and the new Ehatever?  Hybrid/hybrids, I'm not sure one or both, but something.

I looked in here hoping to find some clarification as, frankly, what I thought as much of a read as fair without actually buying left me confused - but find I'm talking to myself.

Huge "Autocar image", else I'd have bought it, but a lot from Popham - or someone - that I've not seen before.  Electrification certainly.

Perhaps I've been working too hard.....................  but I will confess that something said in confidence to me - respected absolutely of course - is now one of Sainsbury's offerings.

[mdavies]

OK, not hallucinating.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/magazine

 

Edited February 26, 2020 by mdavies

[The Pits]

Sorry, it's not clear (to me at least) what your concern is here Mel, some possible spell checker/typo errors at critical places perhaps? There's a thread on the Autocar article here

The future of Lotus appears to have been delayed for another year by the look of it. My best guess is they've taken the decision to go hybrid which has set them back further. Trying to create some link to continuing what the Evija started I guess. The Evora based car was supposed to be the interim model bridge between the current range and the 'all-new' cars which are still a long way off. As I understood it Lotus wanted the Evora based car to be a 2 seater Cayman level 4 cyl hybrid auto but were considering using a run of V6 cars to get the thing to market sooner. Sounds like that idea might have been scrapped and the car will appear later rather than sooner as a hybrid and pitched above the Cayman level into 6 figure territory. Perhaps Porsche's U turn on the 4 cyl Cayman has caused them to rethink? They might like to also consider the reception to Honda's expensive hybrid-only new NSX! 

 

[electro_boy]

Oh wow, thanks for the heads up!  Is this based on actual information released from Lotus or another "Autocar has a guess at the future"?  They do like to mock up lots of renderings based on mostly hearsay.  Might have to go get a copy! 

If that is the new design for the Espirt, then I like it! Lots of similarities to the Evija!

3 minutes ago, The Pits said:

They might like to also consider the reception to Honda's expensive hybrid-only new NSX! 

I'm no expert on the new NSX but I thought its lack of sales was down to it just not feeling very special?  A very fast and competent car but lacking any real drama and emotion?

[mdavies]

Jonny, thanks for the info - not aware of that Esprit thread.  However the Autocar info covers more than the Esprit and is truly well referenced on the Future of Lotus thread - IMO.  Certainly more in the article than that Autocar "Esprit" image. (Your previous post re delay etc refers.)

No typos or concerns!  I was really surprised to see nothing on this thread and tried to be a little entertaining about it, that's all! 

Edited February 26, 2020 by mdavies

[stephenwhyte]

 

[Bibs]

1 hour ago, The Pits said:

My best guess is they've taken the decision to go hybrid which has set them back further

I wouldn't think they'd go hybrid due to the weight. 

[NedaSay]

Using Geely-Volvo tech to go hybrid is easy though. But Hybrid is worst option in terms of driver dynamics...

[Bibs]

https://theredline.com.au/interview-david-mcintyre-lotus-cars/

[mdavies]

"It will come with an internal combustion engine"

As I understand it, hybrids have one of those...........So no new information.

Now had a chance to read the Autocar article properly. Seems to me a mishmash of references to the 2 seater based on the Evora chassis, and a future Esprit. I'm guessing - guessing- more the next  2 seater than the Esprit, despite the assumptions of the other thread. But WDIK. 

Finally "it will come with"......... slightly unusual phrasing to my mind. Something wrong with a simple "have"?

Edited February 26, 2020 by mdavies

[hedgerley]

The sidebar piece is actually more interesting. In the 'bowels of Hethel' they are scanning and fully digitising an Esprit S1. Now why would they be doing that I wonder? One might conclude that if they are indeed considering a new Esprit it may in fact be a proper update and evolution of the original wedge. Now that could be very interesting.