Scottish Independence

[iainskea]

You haven't lost it yet fellas, but the last minute offers are funny to watch lol

[mdavies]

Funny in a disgraceful way!  And that we turn now to our one time saviour of the £ - Gordon the Great - to once more stand as the last resort for the UK, our hero when desperate measures are needed.   I always said he was wonderful.

 

Salmond's great deceipt: nothing new, but well put.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/jeremy-warner/11083005/The-big-deceit-at-the-heart-of-Alex-Salmonds-Yes-campaign.html

[Stirling_Villeneuve]

Absolutely, too little, too late and from a government you can't trust. It'll be a disaster for all of us if Scotland vote Yes, I don't blame them for wanting to get rid of the Tories but at what cost? The No campaign's been too negative to be credible, which is a lost opportunity. I just hope people think beyond the immediate joy of sticking one in the eye to Cameron and think about future generations. 

[sailorbob]

I think the last minute bribes the no campaign are now slinging out are sickening and rather desperate. The markets gave a strong indication of what they think yesterday and this probably gives more of a message against the yes vote.

This has popped up on the epetition website

http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/65616

May be not worded in the best way but I suspect the sentiment of a lot of rUK is in a there.

[Stirling_Villeneuve]

So the party leaders are off to Scotland...

 

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/09/cameron-clegg-miliband-emergency-visit-scotland

 

At least Clegg's a man of his word... just ask a student! I'm sure a few nurses would be happy to vouch for Cameron's integrity too. 

 

 It's all so desperate and given what's at stake really very sad. 

[Chillidoggy]

All I know is the value of my holiday money is fast disappearing, Mr. Salmond.

[Advantage]

I'm still amazed that the Yes campaign even has any credence. Are the YESers so desperate to split that they actually believe the misinformation that Salmond continually spouts? Pretty much every perceived benefit he has proffered has been knocked back as being false or untrue by independent experts.

Yet still the campaign gathers momentum. Baffling. 

[Stirling_Villeneuve]

True... it seems they've been boosted by the No's campaigns initial complacency and now their desperation. 

[Advantage]

Thing is, the No campaign was always going to be hampered by the incumbent government. "Tory Eton Toffs" are nothing but something to be disliked by those of a certain demographic who still blame Thatcher for, well, everything. You're never going to get past that sort of bias.

[Stirling_Villeneuve]

I agree totally, it's the policies of this government have brought the UK to the brink of break up. Meanwhile the real issues at stake are clouded by the short term gain of removing an unpopular government with potentially catastrophic results both sides of the border.  

[mdavies]

Leaving aside the present "government as a whole", because the left/right business is not relevant to this, could the root of the position we (Britain, that is) are in be Cameron's apparent lack of vision/direction/beliefs/spirit in any deep sense - however effective or not he is as a pragmatist and in dealing with "current issues"?  If that "detachment" includes a lack of feeling for "the essence of Britain and its worth", it could explain both his attitude to Brussels and his casual endorsement of "give the Scots the choice and accept the result".

[mdavies]

The major issues have been well rehearsed. Would some potential Yes voters perhaps be more influenced by thinking of the practical consequences on the ground of having "embedded foreigners"? (Both sides of the border.)  Not the ones living physically and mentally entirely in Glasgow (e.g.) perhaps, but some. 

 

In rUK, who will a recruiter interview or promote, given two candidates of equal merit - the Scot?  Which will be picked for a team?

 

In rUK schools: "Miss, miss, my Dad says you are foreign now! And we have been paying you lots of money for ages!  And you keep giving Conal "A's" - it's not fair."  Pity poor Conal in the playground - and little George in Scotland.  And perhaps Miss, in private, crying and wanting a job back in Scotland but her English husband works in London.  

 

Many small shops and businesses operate on slim margins - a small drop in turnover could finish them. Which will suffer most, given similarity? Evoy's or McEvoys?

 

Then there are departments managed by a Scot, staffed by rUKs ................... 

 

As constant daily background there will be live issues of disagreement filling the media.

 

The same applies to rUKs in Scotland but the voters won't care about that - but they might about their relations and off-spring living down south.

Edited September 9, 2014 by mdavies

[red vtec]

It has become a complete farce in a dangerous way, who ever wins will only be by the smallest margin. How can that possibly be a good way to decide such an important change?

 

There seems to be no realisation from our govt that there is an engrained hatred of the English from a hardcore section of Scots, and that a large amount of the English are fed up with having no say in the Scots being given more and more self rule.

 

Regards Cameron, the man has no Gravitas, I heard him speaking the other day and he just sounded like a junior manager.

 

It will be the Welsh next, then NI will kick up again.

[Stirling_Villeneuve]

Thoughts on the proposed 'No' deal are already coming from NI... 

[73JPS]

Making headlines here with one of our two national papers. There is some validity in comparing the Scotland situation to the separtist movement in Quebec here in Canada. If its any consolation, the polls showed a possible "yes" (separation) victory for them in 1995; the result was  "no", though it was close. I have noticed a trend in recent years of polls being notoriusly unreliable. I wonder if sometimes these polls really motivate the side who is predicted to "lose".

 

http://www.nationalpost.com/index.html

Edited September 10, 2014 by 73JPS

[Wally Finland]

All I know is the value of my holiday money is fast disappearing, Mr. Salmond.

And my shopping trip to UK will be much cheaper in October.

[hedgerley]

I've been watching the comments coming through on various sites today - BBC, Scotsman newspaper etc. There are entire businesses, real people, with real jobs already moving South. Investors, shareholders and management in several companies have already made the decision. Individuals have already accepted positions South of the border and are uprooting their families. This is just with the RISK of a Yes decision. The uncertainty and in some cases the animosity from the Nats has already forced their hand.

 

This is just the tip of the iceberg - witness today's announcement from Standard Life. The CEO has written to all their customers outlining their options to move billions in fund deposits South and manage accounts from London to ensure they continue to be denominated in Sterling and can benefit from the certainty of a known tax and regulatory regime, backed up with the security of the BoE as Lender of Last Resort.

 

Salmond's response this afternoon - absolute nonsense and yet more scaremongering. So, a multi-billion pound company publishes their contingency plans in their Annual Report. They outline the risks of independence to their Shareholders and the London Stock Market. And now the CEO has written to all their customers personally. And Salmond dismisses their position out of hand. Unbelievable.

 

And me? I consolidated 3 Standard Life policies into one of my other pension funds 18 months ago (and bettered the return in the first year by over 100% btw). And we always planned to downsize this year so have just sold the house (it was on the market for less than 24 hours!) so my RBS mortgage is about to be cleared. And I've moved my business and personal banking out of RBS as they refused point blank to consider a loan we asked for earlier this year. So we are about to clear all our debts and put a considerable amount of cash in my (non-Scottish) bank and I'll be topping up my (non Standard Life) pension pot. We've also decided to rent as we don't want to be beholden to the banks ever again. And we are not the only one's doing this at the moment.

 

Capital Flight post 18 September? Its already started.

 

And all this from someone who believes common sense will prevail and it will be a No vote next week!!! But I always suspected it would be close and the hiatus could play havoc with our finances so I took the necessary precautions. But we have every intention of staying here - its too damn beautiful a country. And as for the roads ....

[mdavies]

It seems Cameron has picked up my suggestion (in my first post re this above, but also to my MP few days ago) of having a rUK "referendum" to show support for holding on to a United UK.  Have just received an email asking me to please sign up on internet site.

 

https://www.letsstaytogether.org.uk/

 

Though I did not mention it here, I also suggested campaigns based on "special interest groups" (such as motor clubs of course!) contacting their equivalents in Scotland.  And that too!  Apart from that very simple signup process, there is something more complex that I have not checked yet ("Heartstrings" - Ugh, but desperate times!) that links from the same site - seems to link on to Facebook or Twitter.

 

So there are ways, for everyone who wishes, to express support for the UK. 

 

(PS: No of course it's nothing to do with me - the system does not look as if it has been knocked up in 24 hours!  And that site may have existed for a long while.)

[softlips]

 

Regards Cameron, the man has no Gravitas, I heard him speaking the other day and he just sounded like a junior manager.

I agreed a point, but have you heard Ed Milliband?

[Bibs]

He sounds like a dim junior manager

[DanR]

I'm confused. Is Scotland still a colony? Why are they so slow after the other colonies quit the empire?

[iainskea]

Scotland was never a colony. It is a country (with a capital city) and equal part of the 'United' Kingdom, also call Great(er) Britain formed progressively from 1707. Other countries, Wales etc came after.

[Bibs]

In todays news even the Royal Bank of Scotland said they'll relocate south if there's a 'yes' victory...

[Stirling_Villeneuve]

As much as I think a 'Yes' vote would be bad thing for all of us, I can see his point...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqgkZDbe4Xk

[oneshot]

Scotland was never a colony. It is a country (with a capital city) and equal part of the 'United' Kingdom, also call Great(er) Britain formed progressively from 1707. Other countries, Wales etc came after.

Not technically true - Wales is a principality not a country.