Future of Lotus

[TBD]

Very unlikely as Volvo has no V6 in their programme today. Their largest powerplant is the hybrid B4204T35 which produces 320 PS.

[NedaSay]

This is not quite accurate, the Polestar version of this engine develops nearly 370bhp without the hybrid component. However, I concur that it is unlikely we'll see this engine in the bed of an Exige or Evora as their engine bed was not built for a 4cyl inline.

I can see the Geely V6 replacing the Toyota engine after some fiddling from Lotus engineering,  I think Geely wouldn't mind shifting a few more units of this  engine (codename JLV-6G35V). In design this V6 is a clone of the GR-FE, same displacement, same architecture, similar VVTI or DI systems. Euro V compliant so it will require some tuning to comply with Euro VI+. It would probably  be cost efficient to switch from Toyota to Geely and I think the egos of at Geely engineering would be well disposed if such an even was to take place. In normally aspirated tune this engine generate the same sort of horsepower the GR-FE does, nearly 280bhp so if Lotus and Geely engineering get on this thing and do a specific build we could see great things. It's all a matter of how much Geely is willing to invest and how many engineers they can divest to the project. 

As a corporate project I think it would be a boost for all involved either in the UK or in China getting a new high performance engine out can only be a catalyst for great things from this point of view, it is ideal to get the spirits high. However Geely and Lotus also have bean counters and they may say no to such an expanse but I fail to see why it would make sense to listen to them at this point.     

[BfranklynV6]

4 hours ago, NW76 said:

I bet within the next 12-18 month (prior to the new Elise) we will see a Exige/Evora that is superior to the 430s  that will have a Volvo Turbo charged engine. The engines are already in Hethel arent they? ;-) 

Cheers

Norbert 

Does anyone know how these turbo volvo engines actually drive? I only think lotus would go for them if the turbos were as linnear and ‘unnoticable’, like the variable geometry ones on the Porsche 718s. 

Can’t have any lag in a lotus.

[NedaSay]

The top spec 2L- 367bhp Polestar engine has not only a turbocharger for the high end torque but also an electric supercharger for the low end torque, so they suffer from no lag whatsoever.

[Sport220]

When is Lotus getting a car configurator back on their website? You can't even download a brochure for an Elise... 

Hope a site revamp is happening soon 

[AK70]

öhmmm Lotus seems not to be at Geneva 2018...  mhmmm

[Bibs]

Geely don't do car shows I believe.

[C8RKH]

Trade shows are getting less and less valuable in general. Money for old rope and you end up chasing the trade show for launches / updates rather than choosing your own time and approach.

Just my humble opinion.

[AK70]

Volvo will present the new V60... 

Not presenting anything hardly helps Lotus. 

[Bravo73]

Will they have anything left to present at Geneva?

We’ve still got plenty of time for a further 14 special editions before then. 

[Sport220]

Again?  I thought they would be introducing the Evora Roadster 

What about Goodwood? Porsche is celebrating 70 years too and will be a central feature of the show, hope Lotus will be there too

[scotty435]

The best thing Lotus could do this year is to have a 70th anniversary at Hethel like 10 years ago for the 60th. Invite all lotus owners and probably more important the motoring press to show there next 5year plan with maybe 1 or 2 concepts, exciting time for the brand with the new ownership they need to make the most of it.

[AK70]

I hope they do something at Goodwood.. but if you want to sell something internationally, Geneva is the place to be!

Check the list of exhibitors:  https://www.gims.swiss/en/exhibitors/

Everybody is there....

To the "Lotus-has-nothing-to-present" argument:  Who has seen the GT410? Any review? ...

I'm fully aware the financial situation at Lotus is what it is. I think, I am just disappointed to see, that even with Geely nothing more seems possible than before... Maybe we all just overestimate the financial influence of Geely here..

[C8RKH]

@AK70 - I don't get the big push for Geneva, Geneva, Geneva other than your and its location!   As you have said EVERYONE will be there so there is also a risk that launches from the likes of Lotus and other "niche" suppliers will be lost in the glitz and noise from the big boys.  How much press and interest will Lotus get, if Porsche go all out there for a 70th "event" using Geneva Show as a platform?  Lotus would be in danger of getting drowned out.

I'd much rather see Lotus do high quality, targeted, smart thinking marketing than just be somewhere because "everyone else is".  These shows are hugely expensive and with a limited marketing spend it is all about bang for the buck.

I'd be disappointed if Lotus where there and wasting what precious spend they had - so the exact opposite to your position.

Maybe Geely have done their research and realised that the only people who make money out of these shows is the organisers!  That's smart on their part.  The dynamics are changing.

[AK70]

@C8RKH:  I hope you are right! And I agree partly we you ;-)

I am a Lotus Fan and have owend an Esprit and currently an Evora.

Regarding Geneva and the " The dynamics are changing", some hard facts:

 Visitors:

 

 

• 2017: 691'000

• 2016: 687'000
  
  2015: 682'000

• 2013: 690'000
  

• 2010: 692'000
  

• 2009: 648'000

• 2008: 715'000

• 2007: 730'000

• 2006: 674'000

Don't see much of a change here... 

Regarding the high quality, targeted, smart thinking marketing... I fully agree! I would love to see that! But have we??

 

[Bibs]

52 minutes ago, AK70 said:

I'm fully aware the financial situation at Lotus is what it is

Turnover is up 20% (from £80m to £100m) and this years figures show a good profit before interest/taxes etc (£6.5m). Last years figures were a loss of £20m and this years would have been higher had DRB not taken a £4.5m charge during the sale process. 

That said, they are recruiting 300 engineers before the end of next month, I'd rather they spent money on their wages than a car show. People don't really buy cars at car shows I've been told. 

[C8RKH]

@AK70 that's a 2.4% growth in visitor numbers over 11 years.  Hardly a success story is it. And, the crucial thing is, how many of those people went on to buy a car as a direct result of the motorshow?  I am sure Lotus has somewhere the data to correlate and confirm the number of cars sold against attendance at these types of events over the years. I guess that is one of the advantages of selling circa 2k cars a year - you know the detail about who, when, where etc...

I'm sure we are both similar in our goals of wanting to see Lotus cars and see lotus flourish. I guess my point is would be at Geneva represent good value for money and a good return for Lotus - let's say the cost of attendance was £300k - the average cost of a Lotus car is what £65k as sold - assume a profit margin on the cars of 12.5% - so £300k divided by £8.2k (average profit per car) = Lotus would have to sell at least 37 extra cars just to cover the cost of being there. I guess it is doable and the math might stack up, but it is a big cost, and also a big distraction for a small workforce to cope with.

22 minutes ago, Bibs said:

Turnover is up 20% (from £80m to £100m) and this years figures show a good profit before interest/taxes etc (£6.5m). Last years figures were a loss of £20m and this years would have been higher had DRB not taken a £4.5m charge during the sale process. 

That said, they are recruiting 300 engineers before the end of next month, I'd rather they spent money on their wages than a car show. People don't really buy cars at car shows I've been told. 

Hear hear.

They need to return the Motorsport people and get that operation back up and running for new product development and customer support. A huge mistake to shut that down in my humble opinion and they could quickly return it back to operation now. The longer they leave it the harder it will be.

[silverfrost]

It seems a fine Balance to find,     Mr Bahar obviously trashed the budget of lotus and then some,   I admired his big push with the  new concepts he created for the brand, but not the lavish stuff that went on at the shows etc,  I personally think just magazine articles etc  for the foreseable future to keep the costs down, but keep the cars in the public eye as much as possible , as on the road you hardly see any which is a shame !

The results Bibs has just posted, they seem to be doing pretty well, anything in the black is good, given they where in the red last year. 

I wish they could also get Classic team lotus to move to Hethal to be mixed in with the factory day visits as it would be nice to see.  Motorsport as said above is a big selling point and always has been, would love to see lotus pushing into other motorsport events etc. 

[Bibs]

9 minutes ago, silverfrost said:

I wish they could also get Classic team lotus to move to Hethal to be mixed in with the factory day visits as it would be nice to see

CTL are 50 yards away from Lotus, you can include them on a factory visit and they've just spent a fortune on a new building so I doubt they'd want to move just over the road! 

[C8RKH]

I did CTL when I did my factory tour early 2017. If they've moved into the new building then I really need to get down there again to see the whole new experience. Well, it has to be done....  And it is bloody good to see the old cars and the old boys who work on them!

[Andyww]

22 hours ago, C8RKH said:

Trade shows are getting less and less valuable in general. Money for old rope and you end up chasing the trade show for launches / updates rather than choosing your own time and approach.

Just my humble opinion.

Yes and likely no more dolly birds either.

[C8RKH]

1 hour ago, Andyww said:

Yes and likely no more dolly birds either.

Oh well what is the point of these shows then anymore!

Time to start a new car company - Butch cars. Only v8 and V6 petrol engines. Only 2+0 seating. Coupe and spiders only. Big fat wheels and tyes and a minimum of 2 central exhausts.

Built by real men for men. Sold by dolly birds.

Will get the crowdfunding page going.

"The Butch PhwoarrV8 twin turbo spyder - built in a hen shed by real men for real men". Girls only allowed in the passenger seat or on the bonnet. Go on mate, you know you want one....

 

Now. Obviously I am only joking but if Heineken made cars, it would be a Butch Phwoar!

Who's in?

[swindon_alan]

4 hours ago, C8RKH said:

"built in a hen shed by real men for real men"

Bugger. So only @Barrykearley Esprits then... <sigh>

[NedaSay]

So before the 2 new sports cars do show up and now that they have announced the final 3Eleven 430 final run,... . What is next? We've been waiting for a long time for an Evora roadster. The Evora 400 is pretty much du for a refresh not to say a GTfication. The Exige Cup 430  has everything of a swan song but I do not think it is quite time for the Exige to drive into the sunset. The Elise is set to soldier on for a little while longer I think but I doubt it will remain unchanged, so what can we anticipate? 

[Jeanvm]

Something for the new Elise?

Toyota sets in Geneva a new petrol engine for which the hybrid drivetrain of the Prius. And there would be this new engine also a hybrid derivative. Both versions are for future models.This engine would be unbeatable economical thanks to a new technology to reduce friction and new, more efficient in-and exhaust systems. The petrol two litre 169 HP develop and would later be combined with an electric motor. In other words, there are two versions of in the near future. According to Toyota applies the block in both forms in the nose of all models that rest on the TNGA platform. And he is also associated with a completely reworked CVT automatic. For more detailed information about this new technical solutions we have to wait until next week when the 88th edition of the Geneva Motor Show opens the doors.