pnm brake kit installed

[top-plumber]

Hey Ian, noticed you are selling a petrol tank on eBay. Might bid if it fits my S4. :-)

[Chillidoggy]

PM'd.

[Chillidoggy]

I never managed to get to Hi-Spec today, the weather was quite bad and I abandoned the idea, so phoned instead. It seems they had a salesman leave before Christmas, and the remaining guy is rushed off his feet. I'll have another go soon.

 

Having dragged my backside around the web, it seems there are a great deal of people not happy with parking brake performance, going back a long way. And not just for Lotus cars, either. I did some research on Wilwood parking brake calipers, but didn't like what I read about their spot caliper. They do make an alternative MC4, but I don't have any info yet.

[davevr6car]

I redid my brakes completely on my S4s. On the rear I'm using S350 discs. I'm using the standard brembo caliper on S350 brackets for hand brake only. For actual braking I've installed 4 piston Comp brake calipers on S300 brackets with spacers in the S300 location, forward of the disc. Up front I have S350 discs and AP calipers. I have done away with the aBs system, this is a shite system no matter what anyone thinks. I'm running an SE vacuum pump in place of the AC pump. This feeds an Audi A6 vacuum reservoir which feeds a Nissan Patrol brake servo and master cylinder. I have fitted a turbo manual bleed valve and vacuum gauge before the vacuum reservoir with non return valve. What all this means is I can adjust the amount of vacuum assist, ie I can have -20psi or less of brake assist. The brakes are now awesome. On wet road conditions I reduce the amount of assist. In my opinion there's no point in blowing loads of money on upping the size of your brakes unless you get rid of the standard abs.

[top-plumber]

ABS Disabler

A Guide turning off your ABS

(non-LEW )

This is on LEW. It works as I have done this mod.

It's under the chassis heading in modifications and maintenance.

[Chillidoggy]

What's the issue with the standard ABS? Does it not work, then? I thought it was supposed to be a good thing, stopping wheels locking up?

[Bibs]

Its too sensitive, and when it engages the pedals drops and it feels like you're accelerating! Even braking on an uneven surface or over potholes sets it off.

[Chillidoggy]

I've done very few miles in my car so far, but let's just say I wasn't exactly overawed by the braking, particularly given the engine performance. The pedal feel was..............unusual, to say the least. I had no ABS warning light showing, but the hard stops I did do, it seemed to snatch the RH front wheel, and I didn't detect any ABS action to be honest.

 

It is likely that I will change the system at some not-too-distant point in time, as it appears to be over-complicated. I'm pondering a standard servo/master cylinder set-up, with an electric vacuum pump, and possibly an accumulator. This is however all pie-in-the-sky at present.

[Vanya]

Do you have the Delco Morraine or Kelsey Hayes system? (Can't recall the change point right now).

 

The DM on my SE is a bit naff so if you've got that I know where you're coming from - and the ABS when it does kick in is kinda dramatic. The V8 system is a billion times better - really bites hard. 

[Chillidoggy]

I have no idea which system is fitted, I suspect it might the Delco one. I know the brake calipers are Brembo, but beyond that I don't know.

[Sparky]

only later V8s and GT3s have the Kelsey Hayes. Light years ahead of the Delco system.

[bens4s]

I haven't driven the car with new brakes yet, we're still tracking vacuum leaks. My abs has been removed though. I think its a Toyota booster. It has a vacuum tank, but i bypassed it during my search for vacuum leaks. It didn't seem to make a difference with or without it. I am using engine vacuum to run the booster. Would using a vacuum pump make a difference?

Edited February 5, 2015 by bens4s

[top-plumber]

The S4S is the Delco ABS system, as is mine. The wooden feel and back pressure on the pedal is a pest,  especially with the older Bendix brakes which mine had. However with the ABS disabled I still have the brake and  brake pump warning light on the dash keeping me aware of issues.

I thought the Brembo brake upgrade on the later S4 and all subsequent models was supposed to be really good. Not sure you need to uprate the brakes Ian, perhaps a service kit, new pads and discs and a change of oil.

 

Wayne

[Vanya]

also if you haven't already, sit down with a cup of coffee and read through this thread:

http://www.thelotusforums.com/forums/topic/69952-delco-brakes-get-them-working-successfully-and-well/

 

Given you've just pulled the engine from your S4s I daresay installing a gauge in the brake circuit will be a doddle for you. Might throw up some interesting facts. I plan (one fine day...) on checking my own system out just to see how far off it is from factory spec - I personally can't diss the brakes definitely until I've tried out the DM system the way Lotus intended it to be. I suspect mine could do with a tune-up. 

 

Sparky: light years is about right. 

[Chillidoggy]

I managed to speak to a nice guy at Hi-Spec Brakes this morning. He confirmed johnstone's earlier post that an alternative mechanical parking brake caliper is due "in two or three months", plus an electric option for it later on. All will be available through PNM when available. Good news!

[Dave Freeman]

Hi folks, I put the same set of 4 pots and 6 pots on mine, brake are brilliant, but the parking brake is no where near good enough, I too have a sympathetic mot station.

I will post up some pics

[bens4s]

The parking brake is weak! I probably need to readjust it. It worked ok the first couple times, but after maybe 20 pulls its done. All the way up, and it rolls down my driveway. This is pitiful for a brand new setup ordered specifically for the esprit. I have to use a stopper when parked in the driveway. Its maybe a 20 degree slope.

[superdavelotus]

The PNM brake kit is an adapted Hi-Spec kit for the Esprit, it's not a designed one for the Esprit. I used to do a lot of testing of brake kits for PNM back in the day and the rear handbrake was always an issue, hence why I left my Brembo rear caliper on. It's really a Hi-Spec issue not a PNM issue and I suspect as soon as a better handbrake caliper comes on the market, they will be the first to adapt it to the Esprit.

In the meantime, I am sure there is some adjustment to be had on your current system.

Regards

David

[bens4s]

I adjusted the Allen screw and it seems to be holding well again. As easy as it is to adjust, its not a big deal. It took 1 minute. Thanks to the previous post on how to.

[bens4s]

Well the brakes have been working ok, but man they squeel like hell. Is anyone else familiar with green stuff pads? How long should it take for them to quiet down?

[Bibs]

As long as it takes you to remove them and fit decent pads to the car

[bens4s]

Shit. I guess that's what I get for going with the suggestion from pnm. I have no idea what's good or not. That's why I paid them all that money.I bought the best setup they offer and they gave me shitty pads?

Edited March 7, 2015 by bens4s

[bens4s]

What pads do you recommend I purchase for this kit? I want the best and quietest option.

[Vulcan Grey]

I'm not aware of which pad shapes fit the PNM calipers... 

 

But depending on your use...

 

I like Ferodo DS2500 for some street ability with some track ability.  They are similar to what Lotus ships on the Evora.

 

For the squeal, is there any chance you got something on the pads or rotors like brake fluid? Or grease?

[bens4s]

Thanks, ived tried wiping the rotors and they seem dry. There is a ton of brake dust though. I've been spraying water to clean it and their quiet for a few minutes. The pad company said it was normal and I needed 500 to 1000 miles before they would consider it an issue. Bs.that will take me years to hit that mileage.