Preemptive maintenance or 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it'?

[RobinB5]

Was wondering what people's opinions are with regards 2 opposing schools of thought about maintenance:

On the one side there is a 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' approach, which is fine and cost effective until something does brake, possibly when you're driving, leaving you stranded.

On the other side is a more preemptive approach, fixing things that have a higher probability of failure, a priori, to hopefully ensure each and every journey is breakdown free. But sure, potentially more costly in the long run.

The far extreme being a nuts and bolts restoration, most costly by far, but recreating production level reliability.

With the wealth of knowledge and experience documented on TLF, and given an Esprit with a documented maintenance history, I'd have thought someone might have created a 'to do' list of pressing required maintenance activities?

Although reading TLF posts is somewhat akin to reading the reviews on TripAdvisor (if you only did that you'd never go on holiday), there are common issues that arise, each with their own probability.

Has anyone considered creating a probability list of commonly encountered failures, derived from the 1000s of TLF posts? (I'm sure regular and long term contributors to TLF have an intuitive feeling of such a list already?)  Would be fascinating. Might even form the basis of a business model should anyone be so inclined! There are those of us who might like to invest in a preemptive maintenance schedule as we don't have the mechanical skills to perform them ourselves but would be willing to annually invest in such preemptive work, if nothing else to to pay for peace of mind!

[Sparky]

Follow the Esprit service schedule to the letter and you're probably as preemptive as you need to be.  For 40 years I've witnessed people taking maintenance shortcuts (the Esprit is a major victim of this) and getting all kinds of expensive surprises as a result.  I print the service checklist for every Esprit that comes in, and I address every item (generally excepting geometry which is very much individual).  I seem to spend a lot of my time giving bad news to owners though!  But yes, this is at least preemptive.  Many major issues can be avoided in this manner.

As we all know, the Esprit has a fair list of common failures - tanks, radiator, manifold and quite a few more - but adherence to the schedule should find these issues before they become major problems.  The undeserved LOTUS acronym derives from owners who try to avoid effort and expense, IMHO.  I imagine I spend more time fixing bodges than replacing/repairing wear & tear items!

I'd say I'm in the 'if it ain't broke..' camp - if it's safe, and I consider it'll last until the next check, then I'm happy to let it go.  I'll always discuss the snag list in detail with the owner though.  Everyone has their preference.  

[RobinB5]

Points well taken @Sparkyregarding the service schedule. I suppose that was evolved based on assumed required maintenance to start with and adapted over the years by Lotus based on experience and warranty claims. I'm not au fait with all the service schedule items but I do wonder if fuel tank breather tube integrity and fuel tank corrosion were specifically covered for example? Or what other somewhat common faults required at least checking.

Maybe put it another way, if the service schedule was to be defined today in conjunction with a 20+ year warranty (if only), I wonder what the complete list of those items might be and checked on what time frequency?

[Barrykearley]

Most important thing to check is it boosts nicely at 100% WOT 🤪

Your next list on PRA is drop the rad pack. Most other things are in order. I’m sure there was a service checklist in the workshop manual 👍

breakdown cover is useful - but I’ve never needed to use it (yet)

[andydclements]

I'm with Sparky, but also take account of the parts coming off Vs quality of the replacement. If you take off a part that was good for 30yrs so obviously relative free of manufacturing defect, and replace it with the cheapest compatible item, then expect to introduce problems.

[CarBuff]

A Shipright's Disease list of things to do when the engine and trans are out would be a Good Thing. (Isn't that the FIRST thing that @Barrykearley does on any new acquisition?)

 

With the Esprit, its not the cost of parts that are ex$pensive, it's the labor, especially when paying a shop.

[RobinB5]

58 minutes ago, CarBuff said:

A Shipright's Disease ...

Had to Google that, brilliant!

[RobinB5]

1 hour ago, andydclements said:

I'm with Sparky, but also take account of the parts coming off Vs quality of the replacement. If you take off a part that was good for 30yrs so obviously relative free of manufacturing defect, and replace it with the cheapest compatible item, then expect to introduce problems.

Had this with the brake pedal switch. Original was assumed faulty, bought a new one (from SJ), it failed. Went back and cleaned the connectors of the original, all fine now. Lotus might be accused of using cheap parts sometimes, but compared to modern cheaper equivalents, maybe not so bad.

[Chillidoggy]

Pre-emptive all the way; if the Esprit breaks down at the side of the road in the pissing rain in the middle of nowhere, I want to be able to say to the wife it wasn't anything I did, or didn't do.

Ignorance and bodgery are the biggest problems for an Esprit.

[Jacques]

I'm with Ian on this and it goes for most other cars and motorcycles as well.

Kind regards,

jacques

[RobinB5]

@Jacques, @Chillidoggy, beyond just the standard maintenance schedule, what diagnostics do you perform to identify any required preemptive maintenance?

[RobinB5]

Does anyone use Espritmon for anything more than fault finding once a fault has been identified?

[Barrykearley]

5 minutes ago, RobinB5 said:

Does anyone use Espritmon for anything more than fault finding once a fault has been identified?

@sailorbob is your man 👍

[Barrykearley]

I’ve a mate who is in charge of planned maintenance on 3000 vans and vehicles. The data they use is very interesting. They deliberately keep their fleets to only a few varieties of van all of which are the same spec. They normally find issues before main dealers even know about them and they address accordingly on a preemptive basis - pulling vehicles in for routine checks and services early when they do find something.
 

You need  a very big sample to do this - a few Esprit owners finding interesting issues over the years isn’t a good base for data analysis 

[Bazza 907]

Agree with Sparky. In 29 years the S3 Esprit has broken down on me only once which I put down to it being properly serviced every year irrespective of mileage.

The Essex never and the Elise only once in 17 years. All are properly (GST) serviced.

Key is to buy one that's been looked after or spend the money getting it back to how it should be.

 

[pete]

28 minutes ago, Barrykearley said:

 

You need  a very big sample to do this - a few Esprit owners finding interesting issues over the years isn’t a good base for data analysis 

It's a good start though

[Chillidoggy]

10 hours ago, RobinB5 said:

@Jacques, @Chillidoggy, beyond just the standard maintenance schedule, what diagnostics do you perform to identify any required preemptive maintenance?

I always have the car up on the lift every two weeks and check to see if there’s anything amiss, and if there is I decide when it needs fixing, triage style.  I’ll only run Freescan if I think there’s an engine problem, or at the beginning of the year when it returns to the road.

The car gets what it needs. I don’t run it on a shoestring because I know that sooner or later the string will break. This pedantic approach has served me well, in 5 years and 17,000 miles its never been on a recovery truck.

[Escape]

On 28/10/2019 at 22:21, RobinB5 said:

Does anyone use Espritmon for anything more than fault finding once a fault has been identified?

Yes, I regularly have it hooked up when driving somewhere, just to see if all the data is as expected. Also a good excuse to venture into higher rev and throttle ranges to make sure the secondary injectors come on (as if much excuse is needed 🙂 ). Come to think of it , it has been a while since I logged a run, will try and do one over the weekend.

As for the original question, I'm of the opinion if it ain't broke, don't fix it. But as @Sparky says, that doesn't mean don't check anything, on the contrary! I don't mind paying for parts that are needed, but don't want to just throw money at it. And I pride myself on running 3 classic cars on a budget you'd be hard pressed to lease a eurobox for. I do want to keep on top of all possible technical matters, I need my Esprit to be reliable as it's my daily driver. Over 4.5 years and about 50k miles she has left me stranded and coming back with a trailer only twice: once when the clutch master failed resulting in no drive and once when an oil cooler line ruptured. Both of those in the past year unfortunately... In my view, the master failure could not have been avoided. I can't see the point of randomly replacing parts solely on age or mileage (cambelt being an obvious exception!), when there's no indication it will fail and as stated above you can't be sure of the quality of the replacement parts either. The ruptured hose might have been identified had I been more thorough during the previous maintenance/check up.

Filip

[RobinB5]

Thanks all! This is excellent advice I assume the regular checks are all visual? Or do you use any instruments? What generally do you look for? Connections? Any leaks (obvs)? Anything else? Any common go-to points that you focus on?

[Sparky]

Some are specific to model, but for an S4, in no particular order:

Fuel tanks

Fuel balance pipe/hoses

Fuel breather pipes

Rad pack

Engine coolant front hose - possible contact with cam sprockets

Cam tower oil leaks

Manifold - especially around exits 3/4.

Missing manifold studs/nuts

Coolant pipes through chassis

Front brake pipes

Engine/heater vacuum pipes & elbows

Steering lower U/J

Gearchange translator assembly

EBPV

Wastegate capsule

Rear wheel bearings (often neglected)

All suspension bushes approaching end of life if not already replaced

Cabin rear bulkhead mountings

Chargecooler mechanical pump

Chargecooler mounting bobbins

Headlamp pod drains

Rear deck drains

Rear upright cracks

Rear body mounting failure

Delco-Moraine ABS - aaaagh

No doubt a few more will come to me...

 

 

 

[Clarky5150]

Holy thread resurrection! 

I just read Sparky's 'List'O'Doom' and found myself nodding at every line.

Half of the things i had to do to get my S4 roadworthy, the remainder I'm tackling as we speak with an engine out refresh (along with revisiting some of the first half items)

Question for the brain trust however... Balance hoses. Stick with the exorbitant 1980s technology OEM or replace with something different?