Coronavirus

[Barrykearley]

The death rate is utter pishe. It varies every year due to seasonal flu, cold weather, pneumonia etc. Also we have an ever increasing older age population - which will be liable to dying - as that’s what happens when you get old.

In the meantime - the government have kept us all locked up for nearly a year and it’s achieved what exactly? Plunged countless into depression, debt, unemployment - then there’s the indirect consequences - watch the cancer figures in the next couple of years - the heart failures - then there’s the massive nhs waiting lists ever growing.

do I buy the fact covid kills - yes I do - but do I think the reaction is ridiculous - oh yes.

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

If the population is getting older, then by definition, fewer people are dying. The last 12 months might have addressed that temporarily.

[Bibs]

2 hours ago, electro_boy said:

But there is the deeper question that is raised; How much is it really worth spending to keep people alive is it all worth it?  I literally don't have a clue how I would start rationalising where I think the bar should be set.

I'm actually reading a book at the moment which addresses this and read this section only yesterday...

https://aperiodical.com/2019/10/the-maths-of-life-and-death-the-god-equation/

[andydclements]

1 hour ago, Barrykearley said:

The death rate is utter pishe. It varies every year due to seasonal flu, cold weather, pneumonia etc. Also we have an ever increasing older age population - which will be liable to dying - as that’s what happens when you get old.

In the meantime - the government have kept us all locked up for nearly a year and it’s achieved what exactly? Plunged countless into depression, debt, unemployment - then there’s the indirect consequences - watch the cancer figures in the next couple of years - the heart failures - then there’s the massive nhs waiting lists ever growing.

do I buy the fact covid kills - yes I do - but do I think the reaction is ridiculous - oh yes.

In the past year the deaths from 'flu have dropped off a cliff, partly because of the precautions that many people are taking (masks, staying indoors, social distancing etc), partly because some who would have succumbed to 'flu instead succumbed to COVID-19, plus whatever yearly factor would have applied due too the variant of the 'flu virus that was going round. 

The point being, as @electro_boy called out, you cannot take the base figure (be that 2019-2020 deaths, average of last few years or whatever),from this years deaths and the difference is the extra deaths due to COVID.

[Barrykearley]

What you most certainly cannot do, is what the government and media are doing, is report covid deaths as anyone who has died within 28 days of a positive test. 
 

its a numbers game for sure - maybe I’m lucky living rurally - but I don’t know anyone who’s succumbed to covid personally. I do know of two people who have - one had terminal cancer and one was 60 with huge underlying health conditions. Both almost certainly would have succumbed to nature or the flu.

the repose to this illness has been daft. It’s not like we are battling Ebola.

[pete]

Now rates are rising rapidly across Europe and Italy about to go into another lockdown surely foreign travel has to be kept to a minimum for a while longer

[andydclements]

That would be sensible Pete, but as a collective, do we as the UK population do sensible?

I think that the government (or Chris Whitty) had said a while back that foreign travel for holidays etc would be unlikely for a while, which we all seemed to forget as soon we got news that infections and death rates were falling.

[Bibs]

[thebartman]

And now that the dispute over supposedly low supply of vaccines by the UK to the EU has changed into a politically charged "Sod you then; we're not going to use your vaccines 'cos they cause blood clots" allows the UK to vaccinate more people more quickly.

How glad to have been removed from the EU dilly-dallying process since Jan 1st.

[mayevora]

[exeterjeep]

My son, who is 35 and works at the main Exeter hospital on one of the wards, had his first dose on Xmas Eve, which we did not know for a week. He was unwell all Xmas and could not get back to work for a week. We took some food/pain killers over to his place so know he was unwell.

Last Thursday he had his 2nd dose and he is again unwell and unlikely to go back to work this week either. He had the Pfizer jabs. Read today that older folks tend to have less reaction than the younger population. Really looking forward to our second jabs.

[Sparky]

I had my first AZ Sunday; Tracy had hers yesterday.  I've experienced no more than a slight headache that may be unrelated, and couple of unusually long sleeps.  Tracy, however, has a sleepless night with a 39deg fever which now seems to be subsiding.

[pete]

Sue was the same,seems to be worse in women than men. Suppose that's the government's fault as well

[andydclements]

Just booked my jabs, the day after I entered this age range, they opened up the bookings for this age range. So end of March, followed by mid June.

[Sparky]

39 minutes ago, pete said:

Sue was the same,seems to be worse in women than men. Suppose that's the government's fault as well

Weaker sex, see?

Where's me flak jacket..?

[910Esprit]

Interesting that the pfizer jab is linked to more blood clots than AZ (although still statistically insignificant).  Does Europe know something we dont, or is it just petulance and mass hysteria at a national level?   Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.        

I had AZ last week, nothing  to report.

[C8RKH]

16 minutes ago, 910Esprit said:

Does Europe know something we don't

This is the EU "punishing" Astra Zeneca - just my view of course but there is no coincidence that this is the AZ jab and the spat with AZ re deliveries to the EU.

[SFO]

Age for jab booking now at 50 and above

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coron...accination/book-coronavirus-vaccination/

13 minutes ago, C8RKH said:

This is the EU "punishing" Astra Zeneca - just my view of course but there is no coincidence that this is the AZ jab and the spat with AZ re deliveries to the EU.

doesn't make any sense. Loudly complain that you don't have enough jabs, then don't use the stockpile you already have.

Plus stop exports to Australia, so you can increase the size of your unused stockpile .. Italian Government looking ridiculous, especially when its own health agency called the pause a "political decision"

EU politicians and Governments looking more and more like irrational banana republics, heading by Queen Banana herself, Ursula 

AZ makes no profit on the jab, so no great commercial loss for AZ

 

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

32 minutes ago, SFO said:

Age for jab booking now at 50 and above

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coron...accination/book-coronavirus-vaccination/

 

Thanks for posting this. Just signed up for first dose next week.

edit. Just got text from my local GP surgery to the same effect, so switched location to there this Friday.

Edited March 17, 2021 by LotusLeftLotusRight

[C8RKH]

32 minutes ago, SFO said:

doesn't make any sense

It's the EU. A bunch of unelected, unaccountable, bureaucrats in Brussels. Why the hell would they worry about "why it makes any sense"?

In The EU, sell your shellfish. Oh, you're now out of it (no other change) nope, you can sell your shell fish just get on with it.

Then, the EU scream that we have put a block on their lavender plant sales as they are infected with something we don't have on UK soil currently and they say we are unreasonable, untrustworthy and not operating to the spirit of Brexit etc.  Make any sense?

[thebartman]

At least we nailed Dutch Elm disease - only got no Elms left 😞  Most island nations are very careful about eco-bio hazards Oz, NZ etc. EU don't get this as they allow freedom of movement to everything (except vaccines) include Lavender (new to me ) and they're essentially mostly land-locked numpties - IMHO of course 😉 

[Barrykearley]

1 hour ago, SFO said:

doesn't make any sense. Loudly complain that you don't have enough jabs, then don't use the stockpile you already have.

Plus stop exports to Australia, so you can increase the size of your unused stockpile .. Italian Government looking ridiculous, especially when its own health agency called the pause a "political decision"

The EU are making themselves look inept and stupid. I didn’t think it possible that they could make themselves look anymore daft - but CV has really helped them to step upto the next level.

My sincere thanks must go the the EU - since they will have now assisted the UK vaccine program as there’s no point in AZ continuing to supply from the UK.

[PaulCP]

2 hours ago, C8RKH said:

This is the EU "punishing" Astra Zeneca - just my view of course but there is no coincidence that this is the AZ jab and the spat with AZ re deliveries to the EU.

And not just shooting themselves in the foot but blasting off both feet in the process as EU vaccines go to waste!

If von der Leyen was a democratically elected leader of the commission the EU public would be calling for her resignation for presiding over an incompetent organisation. Maybe some EU states should do the same.

 

 

[C8RKH]

1 hour ago, PaulCP said:

Maybe some EU states should do the same.

I believe within 12-18 months another state will begin the process of exit from the EU.

I also believe that this year, both Switzerland and Norway will put the EU at a further arms length.

And Russia is agitating right now and will provide "sweeteners" for a state to consider defecting from the EU

 

[pete]

4 hours ago, Sparky said:

Weaker sex, see?

Where's me flak jacket..?

Barry has it