New lowered Redline

[Murdock]

I'm struggling to get past this new lowered rev limit. 6600.... 6600??? 6800 in Sport and Track...

Anything under 7000rpm isn't a sports car in my mind.

Looks like it has been tuned for torque and a more GT type drive

I imagine rpm can be unlocked but will require a full remap by a tuner (we dont know yet if the Emira ecu will be as accesible as the outgoing Evora i guess). Not sure I'm keen to be modding from 'day 1' anyway, just to make the car right for me. Thoughts?

Edited June 18, 2022 by Murdock

[jimichanga]

Agree 7000rpm is a minimum for a sports car engine. What’s the betting the Emira S gets the missing rpm and bhp. The V6 always felt like the cut out was too early at 6800, you really do notice it. Being stuck forever in that would definitely take the shine off it for me.

[KennyN]

Have the rev limits been 100% confirmed?  On the occasions where I failed to select Sport or Race on my Exige it did feel a bit lacking, so that would be a bit of a downer for me.

Tuned for torque can be no bad thing if the curve and gearing are spot on...time will tell I guess.

[Murdock]

Yes pretty sure this is where we are at now.

[Bibs]

https://www.evo.co.uk/lotus/emira

But as you step into the midrange the Edelbrock 1740 supercharger is up and running and the quick jog snaps to a furious sprint as the 394bhp Emira feels good for its 4.3-second 0-60mph time and 180mph maximum. Its performance surge tails off quicker than you might expect, the 6800rpm redline feeling a long way off, which means the six-speed manual is never far from being called into action, which is both a blessing and a hindrance. 

https://media.lotuscars.com/en/news-articles/lotus-confirms-full-specification-and-price-of-all-new-emira-v6-first-edition.html

https://media.lotuscars.com/en/models/emira.html#specs

Max engine speed

6,800rpm

[mdavies]

Not being one of the potential buyers at which the forthcoming version of the Emira is aimed, generally I’ve been keeping thoughts about it to myself.  But having shared KennyN’s “6,800 experience” above in my previous Exige Sport 350, I will add that:

-        A deficiency for the Exige does not necessarily make it one for the Emira, a very different car.

-        The above quote by Bib’s of EVO’s words: “….. performance surge tails off quicker than you might expect, the 6800rpm redline feeling a long way off” emphasises that the torque curve peaks in the upper-mid rpm range and that the 6,800 top figure is of little relevance.

-        For the Emira to give its drivers a decent sense of being in a “performance car”, the torque curve has to “support the weight”. Lotus had little option, I imagine.

-        Overall, as has generally emerged from the reviews (I sense), the Emira is happiest operating up to the 8/10ths level – suiting it’s target buyers.

-        Hence, overall, Lotus has done a decent job of creating a well-rounded package for its intended buying audience – and, necessarily, for itself as a business capable of being ongoing.

So, IMO, it’s not reasonable to be negative about comparisons with the previous Lotus cars, loved by the traditionalists.  Equally, I, and many I believe, look forward to considerably sharper-edged versions of the Emira. (To be assessed very differently!)  

[Bravo73]

2 hours ago, Murdock said:

(we dont know yet if the Emira ecu will be as accesible as the outgoing Evora i guess).

FYI, the OEM Evora ECU is very hard to access. The code is encrypted. 

[jimichanga]

So here we are again making more excuses for ‘the Lotus that needs no excuses’. With a vocal V6, another 200 rpm adds a lot to the enjoyment of the car, particularly in the car billed as the last ever ice Lotus. They have held the Emira back for future models as per standard industry practice but if it’s true that the Chinese i4 has 400bhp then it makes the 360bhp figure we get look arbitrarily under-nourished. It also supports the speculation Lotus did it so as not to show up the ‘flagship’ V6, in China where there is no V6 to embarrass they get the fastest Emira of all. Doesn’t seem right. In either Emira if the power tails off in the upper reaches of the rev range then so will my interest in having one. Plenty out there who prefer to shortshift but I for one would miss the way the outgoing cars rip through the final 1000rpm and crescendo right at the limiter. Such is the intensity, mechanical fury and accelerative thrill that you really notice the lower limit in ‘Tour’. For a moment it feels like there’s something wrong with the car, back into ‘Sport’ and that first run to the limiter is especially satisfying. All is well again and it’s the crazy, howling lunatic you know and love.

Edited June 18, 2022 by jimichanga

[mdavies]

Jimi, I generally share your view.  Hope you don't interpret my comments as "making excuses" for "the Emira that we hoped it would be" - a car for us.

No, I stood back from it a while ago, as details emerged, and I'm commenting on it as it clearly seems to be, and seeing it in relation to the people that it is pointed at.  Not me - nor you, I think.  Pity, but ............... 

[Eagle7]

Based on the reviews, it seems that instead of tuning for the top end, Lotus has tuned the Emira for low to midrange performance, which is what you want on the street and a smart move on the part of Lotus.  They've said they remove the gears in the manual box and make their own gears, so it sounds like they've geared it more for low and midrange as well.  This is in contrast to Porsche which (and this is a complaint I've seen) has gone with tall gearing, and you have to be above 4,500-5,000 rpm to really feel the performance.

Lotus has chosen to end their ICE era with a car that appeals to a much wider customer base than their old one, which under the circumstances is a good move business-wise.  The order book confirms this was/is the right move for them.  It's going to be interesting to see how this new-found awareness and knowledge carries over to their electric future.

[jimichanga]

Low to midrange performance is not what I want from a sports car on the road but all decisions taken by Lotus have been justified by the full order book. You have to wonder what might have been had the Evora been a 2 seater… it’s ingenious 2+2 packaging put it too close to the 911 and it made the unfavourable comparison inevitable.

I don’t believe an Emira in a spec to please everyone here would have sold better and would likely have been more expensive so likely to have sold less as a result. So Lotus were right and I remain surprised by the reaction. Better this way round for once. Beats making inspirational drivers cars that too few appreciated.

Edited June 18, 2022 by jimichanga

[Trevsked]

My feeling is the order books were filled because of the cars looks and certainly for early adopters, the expectation Lotus would at least match the HP of the outgoing flagship Evora, 430hp. Personally I was thinking 440-450hp which the engine is capable of with a little tweak of the gearbox to handle the extra. Hence my slightly drooped shoulders at this point.

 

Trevor.

[Murdock]

Without dismissing everything that has been said above (all valid), this is where I am at after a year...

Is it "forthedrivers"

Or for "ALLthedrivers"

I think if I am being honest with myself this is no longer the car for me, even though I am (allegedly) one month from collection 😞

[jimichanga]

It will still be an amazing car in isolation it’s just those of us who have seen what Lotus can do on a shoestring might be expecting a bit more from a big budget. I suspect it will be more of a slow burner for some in that it might shine more brightly as a longer term ownership proposition than on a 20 minute test drive. It’s got to be the most comfortable and capable long distance Lotus ever, or at least since the Lotus Carlton. I can’t see it matching the thrill of the Exige, not much does, but most see it as an improvement over the Evora even if I am yet to be convinced.

It’s done very well for Lotus already and the only way we’ll see faster versions is if they sell a lot of launch editions so it’s all going according to plan. Doesn’t look like anyone’s going to be out of pocket if they do want to sell any time soon so best to enjoy it for what it is and rack up some miles in the last petrol Lotus.

Edited June 18, 2022 by jimichanga

[Trevsked]

Agree with all the above. I think you’re right and it’s for Allthedrivers and also as a long term there will be little to moan about. I just wanted more power and less weight, seems my request got reversed :-).

Trevor.

[Bee]

As others have said, I think the simple truth is that bhp and rev limits have been dropped so that they can be put back up again when the 'S' (or whatever equivalent they choose) model is released, when the Emira has its first refresh. In fact, I suspect that the V6 may not even soldier on beyond that point, with upcoming emissions regulations tightening around the world. The Mercedes powertrain will just be effortlessly stepped up to 400-420bhp, seeing that iteration of the Emira drop to sub four seconds to 60mph, and a top speed closer to 200mph. If the V6 Emira was launched at 430bhp, how would they find any extra power for the refresh, given that they clearly are not willing to take that powertrain any further with its existing gearbox?

[jimichanga]

‘Supercar looks for sportscar money’ seems to be what has really captured the attention of the new to Lotus buyer who don’t seem to be bothered or perhaps not aware of what the same V6 was putting out in 2017 or that Lotus have docked 60bhp from the AMG turbo 4. Price and styling have been critical up to this point. Any decisions taken by Lotus to alter either could have cost them the wider market they desperately need to reach. The power levels offered seem to be considered ‘fair enough for 60 grand’ even as they write a cheque for £75k.

[TdM]

I like the 60k 75k comment Jimi. I think it's actually another important skill for Lotus to have learned for commercial success. Your marketing price must mask the real price people will be paying.

Next they need to advertise all over TV and radio that you can have a Emira for £22. (Small print, a day, if you ignore down payment, final balloon payment and pay over 5 years)

[C8RKH]

16 hours ago, Bee said:

given that they clearly are not willing to take that powertrain any further with its existing gearbox?

Really? Please substantiate that comment, given that Lotus have previously confirmed the engine and gearbox is good for more, or is just BS, or your point of view?

For what it is worth, I believe the future "sporting" Emira's will be I4 based and Windle already said they were going for a more normal "nomenclature" like S, R, etc.

[Murdock]

430 is about the max the current manual gearbox will take in the V6

They haven't developed it any further to take more power/torque

[C8RKH]

Total rubbish. Plenty of Lotus cars out there with the KomoTec upgrades to circa 490bhp. Where you getting this from?

Lotus have tested it to at least 450bhp too.  Provide some source to substantiate this please.

Edited June 19, 2022 by Bravo73

[Murdock]

I was going to say 430 and 450 nm, but does it really make any difference? It's been well documented that the manual gearbox is the weak link. And it's the torque on the EA60 that's the deal/box breaker

[C8RKH]

3 minutes ago, Murdock said:

I was going to say 450, but does it really make any difference? It's been well documented that the manual gearbox is the weak link

It makes a difference yes.

No one is arguing the manual gearbox is the weakest link but if you're going to post up figures then at least bother to research it and get it right, or, just admit you were just "guessing" or talking nonsense because you'd heard from a mate, for a mate, in the pub, who'd read on the internet.........

[Murdock]

I bet your fun at parties 🥳 

[Bee]

3 hours ago, C8RKH said:

20 hours ago, Bee said:

given that they clearly are not willing to take that powertrain any further with its existing gearbox?

Really? Please substantiate that comment, given that Lotus have previously confirmed the engine and gearbox is good for more, or is just BS, or your point of view?

Tuners will always happily take engine outputs far beyond the manufacturer's own limits, so yes, Komo-tec et al can clearly take the Toyota unit up to 500bhp. However, they are not working to the safer margins a car maker like Lotus has to, in order to guarantee the reliability of said gearbox over the lifespan of the car.

 

Even without a cross-referenced video recording from any Lotus engineers, regarding the exact power limits they themselves chose to set, in order to appease your demands for cast-iron evidence, it seems mind-bleedingly obvious that Lotus would have released higher-powered variants of the Exige and Evora, if they could have, because, well - you know - they would have been better and thus sold more. So, it light of your eloquently phrased enquiry, I would say it's my point of view based on what seems reasonably clear. I could, of course, be wrong; I freely admit to not being perfect, far from it.

 

Please feel free to consider it 'BS' should you wish to: with a great deal of time at my disposal, I would struggle to adequately covey the literally cosmically-scaled size of the sh** I don't give as to whether you do so or not.  

 

PS: I, too, bet you're fun at parties.