Is electric really the answer?

[Techyd]

I've been saying this for a while now - you can't 'just' manufacturer your way out of climate change.  Repairing, reusing, and repurposing are far more powerful tools at curbing emissions.  In the case of cars, its exactly about buying used and keeping what you have for longer.

It's a little way off yet, but vast majority of existing ICE engines can either a) use synthetic fuel or b) be converted over to run on hydrogen (see JCB for their work on developing conversion kits on their heavy equipment vehicles)

(shared elsewhere but worth a watch if you've not seen it already)

 

[Sparky]

8 minutes ago, Techyd said:

Repairing, reusing, and repurposing are far more powerful tools at curbing emissions.

I've had this discussion with numerous snowflakes (most of them leasing) claiming I don't care about the planet due to driving an Esprit.

Also, we've had only 2 family cars in the last 19 years - both sourced for their reliability, economy and ease of repair (fortunate, of course, that I can look after them myself).  Both were bought at around 1 year old at around £10k, and intended to be driven until no longer economically viable.  The first lasted 8 years; the second is still with us and going strong through its 11th year.  Up to 50mpg and very comfortable.  Not only am I well ahead in the eco-warrior stakes, I'm also a 6-figure sum richer.  Well, not really - spent it on booze and travel (there goes the eco-warrior argument).

[Beady]

Collected this Saturday...brave new world.

Purchased via the business so Rishi is giving me a nice big 40% discount of off the cost via capital allowances. Also lets me offset the interest charges as tax deductible.

What's not to like

 

[exeterjeep]

Now available to order - a mini Eletre?

MG 4 XPower is £36,495 0-62mph in 3.8sec, while top speed is limited to 124mph.

MG 4 XPower  320kW of power from twin motors and a 239-mile WLTP driving range from a 64kWh battery pack.

Also made in China in a new factory.

[C8RKH]

Yeah but maximum range239 mies!

Gie that the biggest issue most people have with EVs is rage anxiety, why are we continuing to see manufactures push/prioritise speed performance?

[exeterjeep]

1 hour ago, C8RKH said:

rage anxiety

sounds like me when the wife's driving.

I imagine that the Evija or Eletre flat out would not do too many miles before wanting a rest

[Sport220]

4 hours ago, Beady said:

Collected this Saturday...brave new world.

Purchased via the business so Rishi is giving me a nice big 40% discount of off the cost via capital allowances. Also lets me offset the interest charges as tax deductible.

What's not to like

 

Never thought I’d say this about a Porsche cut I can’t see why anyone would pick a Lotus (Eletre) over it. Nice colour too

Edited June 26, 2023 by Sport220

[Bibs]

They want a Lotus? They want an SUV? It's faster? Charges faster? More range? They just prefer it? Probably cheaper too once the Porsche is optioned up... 

[MPx]

1,2,3 and 6 from that list for me....but also one of my nephew's has had a Taycan for a year or so and has sufferd loads of ag. (eg Several times hasn't even been able to unlock it to get in and use it - which I'm sure was annoying).   In fact I still like the car but why suffer Porker ag when you can stick with Lotus? 

[Sport220]

1 hour ago, Bibs said:

They want a Lotus? They want an SUV? It's faster? Charges faster? More range? They just prefer it? Probably cheaper too once the Porsche is optioned up... 

You lost me at “They want an SUV”. But to each their own, I suppose.

Back on topic. Looking forward to seeing this at Goodwood FoS:

https://caterhamcars.com/en/models/projectv

[Bibs]

I know right, not really a popular segment! Seems Porsche have done ok out of them over the years though, there's some merit to including them in your business plan! 

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

@Bibs

Just curious: how popular is the Eletre sub-forum on TLF? Does it get a lot of traffic, compared to other recent models listed?

[Bibs]

It's the 66th most popular page on TLF! 

[exeterjeep]

Could be on the rise after reviews/test drives/deliveries/issues/warranty.........

[LotusLeftLotusRight]

Thanks Bibs. That doesn’t surprise me. I have barely clicked on that sub-forum since the Eletre was launched and I’m clearly not alone. In contrast I keep up to date with all of the Emira posts, even though I am not in the market for one. 

[Sport220]

12 hours ago, Bibs said:

I know right, not really a popular segment! Seems Porsche have done ok out of them over the years though, there's some merit to including them in your business plan! 

Not sure what’s up with the sarcasm.

I always viewed Lotus as the antidote to Porsche and where I was brought up pretty much every Lotus owner hates Porsches, which used to make for, erm, amusing trackdays. The fact Lotus are doing an electric 120 kWh SUV that weighs as much as a small moon is nothing short of a tragedy to me, as is Lotus enthusiasts trying to justify this with the… 2003 Porsche Cayenne.

The Emira too is heavier than 718 Cayman, so that’s Simplify and Add Lightness put to bed. Be nice if they made a 2-liter lightweight special.

Curious to see how Type 133 and 134 will fare against the Taycan and upcoming electric Macan.

[oneshot]

I was in the Land Rover dealers yesterday ( car in for a service) and the sales guy was telling me that they have been instructed not to take any full electric car in part exchange.

[Mark Blanchard]

[exeterjeep]

43 minutes ago, oneshot said:

I was in the Land Rover dealers yesterday ( car in for a service) and the sales guy was telling me that they have been instructed not to take any full electric car in part exchange.

Was told the same at our local dealer when discussing our delivery a few months ago. They will take an I-pace though!!

[Techyd]

Presumably a lot of the full EV cars have been bought on lease hire through businesses or equally through employee benefits such as salary sacrifice where the extremely high purchase price is offset. In the used market no one can afford them, particularly in light of no more cheap finance.

Most car manufacturers have shot themselves in the foot with the EV into the premium market place as it will lead to market stagnation if people can’t get rid of the EVs they have and are unable to buy new as a result.

I think MG and Renault are taking a better approach with lower end EV models but I seriously question the build quality and longevity of MG cars - and that’s not based on their historical reputation

[C8RKH]

@Techyd I absolutely agree withn your points. The car manufacturers have admitted that they went for the middle/upper class market segments as they prioritized profits (which were much higher than ICE equivalent) over emissions. Another fantasitc example of "green washing" and the middle classes fell for it in spades. They lapped it up. Stupid sods.

Manufactuers went for pizazz, speed and profits, sacrificing what consumers at volume really needed, RANGE and price.  They have absolutely shot their toes off. Stupid sods.

Kia broke the mould, with the Niro etc. MG are booming. 

[exeterjeep]

56 minutes ago, C8RKH said:

MG are booming.

But do have issues - possibly more than other manufacturers - having followed the issues on the MG 4 EV forum. Puts me off buying new model EV from a new factory. Will monitor the new Jeep Avenger - is built in Poland.

[C8RKH]

4 minutes ago, exeterjeep said:

Puts me off buying new model EV

Tesla has had issues, loads and loads, yet people still seem to buy them.

Porsche Taycan's have loads of reported issues. Panamera PHEV's are being written off at 5/6 years old. But people seem to keep buying them.

Ipaces have had loads of issues.......

The key thing for me is how has MG responded under warranty?

I struggle to see past Kia for an EV to be honest. Great design. Great specs. Super warranty. Maybe why people seem to buy them

 

 

 

[exeterjeep]

17 minutes ago, C8RKH said:

MG responded under warranty?

Have had multiple failures of some items, lack of spares arrival to the UK (eg display screens, front windscreens), failed software updates bricking the odd car for a while. Some dealers not interested, some cars rejected. Lane keep assist and emergency braking seem to be a popular problems. Poor quality wiper blades and tyres (also tyres flattened on ships travelling from China). Rear axle leaks, under tray issues. Software locking the car when it thinks it is being stolen whilst being driven, locking people in (can't open the doors or windows), resulted in DVSA recall. But loads of folks love them. Overall MG in China are responding to issues and the more recent deliveries seem to have less things reported on the forum.

[C8RKH]

9 minutes ago, exeterjeep said:

Have had multiple failures of some items, lack of spares arrival to the UK (eg display screens, front windscreens), failed software updates bricking the odd car for a while. Some dealers not interested, some cars rejected. Software locking the car 

Are we talking about the Emira here, or the MG?