1st Lotus! 1978 Esprit S2 - Needs work 🙂 ​

[TheOrs]

Hi

My name is Darren.  I live in Plymouth in the South West of England.  In April last year I bought myself an S2 Esprit that had been dry stored for about 25 years.  The car seems basically sound but I quite like tinkering and I want something (relatively) reliable, so I decided to take the body off & go through the chassis, engine/trans, suspension etc., rather than just trying to get it going.  I left it sitting in my garage for a few months, whilst I plucked up the courage to start pulling it apart, but I've now started dismantling.  The initial parts were fairly straight forward but as I'm getting into it further, I've got questions ("why am I doing this?" is a frequently recurring one! 🙂), so I thought I'd introduce myself here.

I work as an engineer and I've spent a fair bit of time working on different cars; I built myself a Dutton Phaeton when I was 17/18 & I used to work for Marlin cars back in the late 80's, early 90's but I'm by no means an expert.  Despite that, I have found the Lotus surprisingly easy to work on so far, especially compared to more modern stuff.  I've done a bit of lurking here & there's a wealth of information; I've learnt plenty already.  I'm stuck on a couple of things though, so prepare yourselves for the stupid questions!

Cheers

Darren

[Barrykearley]

Welcome chap - whack up some pics - we love pics

[jep]

A warm welcome to you. 

TLF has lots of knowledge, usually serious 🙂

Justin 

[LOTUSMAN33]

Hi Darren

I’m in Plymouth if you need any help or advice 👍🏻

Dave  

[JonSE]

Hello Darren and welcome!

I have a disassembly thread running somewhere, it’s for an S2 and is probably a great demonstration of how NOT to do it!

Joking aside, there are some things that are easier if they are done out of what might appear common sense sequence (looking at you here, pedal box) that become more accessible a couple of steps down the line.

Also it seems that 1X car in pieces seems to need the storage / working space for three cars somehow as you may find!

Good luck and look forward to following your progress….

[TheOrs]

14 minutes ago, LOTUSMAN33 said:

Hi Darren

I’m in Plymouth if you need any help or advice 👍🏻

Dave  

Hi Dave

Thank you very much, that might be really helpful.  I really enjoyed your 'Found first S1' thread.

Darren

[Steve V8]

Hi Darren, Plymouth is a good place to be for working on your Lotus, you may already know this but you have the South West Lotus Centre just up the road in Lifton, they have an Aladin's cave of spare parts, and SJ sportscars a bit further on in Crediton, between them, if they don't have it or don't make it, your out of luck, good luck with the rebuild.

[Fridge]

Tip: if stripping your car down extensively take more photos than you think you will need to put it back together again.

Then double that number. You can never have enough photos to show how it was put together, assuming it was working OK when it was last used. Take photos from all angles of assemblies, no matter their size or perceived simplicity.

You don't know how long it will take you to compete the restoration, and again it is likely to be longer than your initial estimate.

[TheOrs]

Some pics of my car, from when I picked it up.  Spitfire is my son's.

 

 

 

Edited February 2 by TheOrs

[TheOrs]

19 hours ago, Barrykearley said:

Welcome chap - whack up some pics - we love pics

Thanks.  Pics added.

 

19 hours ago, jep said:

A warm welcome to you. 

TLF has lots of knowledge, usually serious 🙂

Justin 

I like that...  If I had a pound for every time I had 'Lots of trouble...' quoted at me in the last 8 or so months, I could probably buy another car!

 

18 hours ago, JonSE said:

Hello Darren and welcome!

I have a disassembly thread running somewhere, it’s for an S2 and is probably a great demonstration of how NOT to do it!

Joking aside, there are some things that are easier if they are done out of what might appear common sense sequence (looking at you here, pedal box) that become more accessible a couple of steps down the line.

Also it seems that 1X car in pieces seems to need the storage / working space for three cars somehow as you may find!

Good luck and look forward to following your progress….

Yes, I've been reading your thread.  Very interesting.  My living room is slowly filling with car parts!  One of the benefits of being single, I suppose.

 

18 hours ago, Steve V8 said:

Hi Darren, Plymouth is a good place to be for working on your Lotus, you may already know this but you have the South West Lotus Centre just up the road in Lifton, they have an Aladin's cave of spare parts, and SJ sportscars a bit further on in Crediton, between them, if they don't have it or don't make it, your out of luck, good luck with the rebuild.

Unusually, as normally everything seems to be somewhere miles away!

 

18 hours ago, Fridge said:

Tip: if stripping your car down extensively take more photos than you think you will need to put it back together again.

Then double that number. You can never have enough photos to show how it was put together, assuming it was working OK when it was last used. Take photos from all angles of assemblies, no matter their size or perceived simplicity.

You don't know how long it will take you to compete the restoration, and again it is likely to be longer than your initial estimate.

Yes, I'm taking photo's of everything I touch.  Unfortunately, I have a brain like a sieve, so it's very necessary.

 

[Fridge]

The interior looks original and almost complete. Marcasite interiors are usually too far gone to save, and the material is no longer available. The London-based company liquidating in the 1990's. The nearest substitutes are also seemingly difficult to obtain also.

My advice would be to have the seats professionally repaired as best as you can. The black nylon used on the seats, bulkhead, headlining etc is available. However the high frequency welded seams are not. Certainly not in the UK. So it would be worth saving those sections.

I would refrain from dying the green Marcasite black, as this tends to end up crusty and loses it's original feel.

[Dan E]

20 hours ago, LOTUSMAN33 said:

Hi Darren

I’m in Plymouth if you need any help or advice 👍🏻

Dave  

and there is your answer 😍

[Steve V8]

4 hours ago, Fridge said:

would refrain from dying the green Marcasite black, as this tends to end up crusty and loses it's original feel.

No wonder the Marcasite company went bust, their black product faded to green in the sunlight within months, it wasn't fit for purpose.

Dye it or rip it out and replace the crap with alcantara or suade, IMO keeping a green and black interior in a car which was supposed to have a black interior is ridiculous for the sake of originality of a fabric. 

 

 

[Fridge]

2 minutes ago, Steve V8 said:

No wonder the Marcasite company went bust, their black product faded to green in the sunlight within months, it wasn't fit for purpose.

Dye it or rip it out and replace the crap with alcantara or suade, IMO keeping a green and black interior in a car which was supposed to have a black interior is ridiculous for the sake of originality of a fabric. 

 

 

Ultimately, keeping it original as you can is where the value is.

[Steve V8]

1 hour ago, Fridge said:

Ultimately, keeping it original as you can is where the value is.

I agree to that to a point, but if you have a red car that's faded to pink, would you leave it pink for the sake of originality? There comes that point where originality detracts from the overall appearance and reduces value, as in this case.

 

[Fridge]

The difference is that you can repaint the exterior of a car and it will be identical to when it came off the production line.

However as I have stated previously, this is not the case with the Marcasite interiors, where the material and its treatment is not replicable.

Without seeing the cabin of this car in detail it's difficult to say in this case whether the interior condition could be sympathetically restored, but I suspect it can be.

However, if the Marcasite has simply faded and is otherwise complete it could be considered patina, and not necessarily wear and tear.

In fact the green is not at all unpleasant. In fact I would say it is preferable to an all black interior, which in a small cabin could be overpowering. Definitely in a car without AC in the height of summer.

If you understand the classic car market at all you'll appreciate that originality is the most sought after.

In the case of Esprit S2s I've seen quite a few over the last 8 years, and the ones that are valued the most all have original interiors. There are another two up for sale currently, both at the upper end of the S2 price range. That speaks for itself.

[Elite 4.9]

Welcome Darren, 

Nice selection for a project with an S2 Esprit!  Iconic styled Lotus for sure.

My grandfather left Plymouth just after queen Victoria's funeral in 1902 and came to the USA and settled in North Dakota in which my dad said it was good place to be from. lol

Take your time restoring and looks like you are starting it well taken the body off. Keep us posted with lots of photos please.

 

Cheers,

Richard

[ChrisJ]

6 hours ago, Fridge said:

There are another two up for sale currently, both at the upper end of the S2 price range.

And the yellow one has the black seats with the green interior as well

[drdoom]

Welcome Darren! Back around '80 a silver S2 enjoyed locally was brought to my attention and I found the car truly striking. Likely going silver when my S2 gets painted. What is the VIN of your new toy?

[TheOrs]

Thanks for all the replies guys!

I must admit I initially thought the green and black interior was original.  It actually works quite well.  I'm undecided what to do with the interior.  I'm pretty sure I'm going to leave the paintwork as is.  I didn't really want a silver car, but the paint is fairly good and the silver is really growing on me.  My main priority is having a car that is reliable enough to enjoy; that's why I'm planning on taking the body off.

[Fridge]

Having done a complete restoration of an S1 (it's documented in the restoration threads somewhere) I would suggest, given your intentions, to concentrate on the running gear, engine and transmission.

These will give you the biggest gains possible, both in reliability and fun.

The relatively puny 2.0L engine is hugely helped by superb road holding and the lightweight construction. Making it a brisk and exciting car to drive.

Once rebuilt get it set up professionally with the correct specs and it'll be a joy to drive. If it retains the original shock absorbers, which were often blue and made by Armstrong, these will often be superior to aftermarket coil overs from the usual suppliers. And provide the car with the ride and handling that Lotus intended.

Not that it might be important to you, but spending money on a retrim and respray etc will quickly blow the value of the car, and as you state, may not be necessary.

Depending upon when it left the production line, it will be worth improving the electrics of the cooling and electric windows by adding additional relays that the early S2s and S1s didn't have. Upgrading the radiator to a triple core and fitting modern cooling fans will be a huge improvement to its driveability too.

It will be interesting to read about your progress and thoughts on the process.

[TheOrs]

So, Big thanks to Dave (Lotusman33).

Dave popped round this morning to take a look at my car and give some advice.  It was mostly good news with a couple of minor issues but Dave also suggested a different approach to my project, which seems to make more sense, so I now need to have a bit of a think...

I also got the chance to look at the two S1 cars Dave is currently working on.  Both fantastic!

Thanks again to Dave & for the warm welcome from other members here.

[LOTUSMAN33]

Great to meet Darren today, lovely fella with a very nice original S2, the body and paint are fantastic with no stress cracks and sunroof free. 
The chassis is solid and it’s had some money spent on it over the years with a good stainless exhaust.

It won’t take much of a boost to give him a good running car with ongoing improvements as budget allows.

I’d certainly would have been happy to find that nestled away local to me, another will be saved soon I feel 🙂

[JonSE]

That interior looks lovely, I’d repair and smooth out as required but work with what’s there if that were mine! Some of the foam underneath can be a bit manky, replace that and re tension the fabric.
 

There's something about the original interior faded down (imo), spend a little money only where required to make it usable and enjoy it!

Mine has been so badly done / redone over the years I’ve no choice, door cards cut for speakers, multiple retrims and the original materials underneath all beyond saving.

If you have the option to not split the body from the chassis and do work on a rolling basis while the car is still on the road for the time being, I’d also consider that route.

Anything you do replace on the meantime will always come in later if you do need to get the body off down the line.

Keep the photos coming!

[Fridge]

If retaining the Marcasite, just don't disturb it all. It's glued to the scrim foam underneath and it tears easily in its aged state. The nylon can be carefully peeled back and retentioned as @JonSEsaid.

En voilà! You have an original looking 1970's cool.